Multimedia Toolkit 2/Multimedia Toolkit 2.iso/imagine/text/archive.21c

Text File | 1993-03-12 | 152.5 KB | 3,849 lines

IMAGINE archive: collected off of [e-mail]

ARCHIVE XXI (PART C)
Apr. 10 '92 - May 15 '92

If you have questions or problems with this file, email Marvin Landis
at [e-mail]

note: each message seperated by a '##'

&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&


Subject:     Enforcer hits w/Trace in 2.0
Date:        Fri, 10 Apr 1992 02:07:39 -0600
From:        HURTT CHRISTOPHER MICHAEL <[e-mail]>

    I've been working on a particular animation in Imagine for a week
now and have rendered it in both scanline and trace. However on my lastest batc
h
Imagine has been crashing and crashing HARD. I ran enforcer & just Imagine from
a reboot. During the palette pass before hitting 50% Imagine makes Enforcer go
nuts. I have had up to this point 0 problems with 2.0, but this problem is very
consistent. If I render the same frame in scanline however,it works without
a hitch.
    I remember some time back a few people where having problems rendering
anims because Imagine wouldn't give back all the RAM when it finished a frame.
I wonder if this a similar problem for I was able to render 14 of 45 before
having this happen. But then, I cannot get it to render frame 15 in trace for
anything. So perhaps it is a problem just with that frame.
    A little info on the scene: 3 lightsources, all cast shadows, a global
brushmap, a "normal" amount of polygons, & brick texture with fully transparent
mortor. (736x482) HAM. A sample from enforcer also follows:

Program Counter (approximate)= 11CEB1E          Fault address       =42000000
User stack pointer           = 1168E84          DOS process address = 1168230
Data: 0101C9C0 FFFEC78A 0242E220 00000008 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000
Addr: 0102A060 42000000 011B442C 01264C24 011AE8BE 01168F38 011B4444 00002E94
Stck: 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 01035FE0 01248428 011B4444 011CE188
WRITE-WORD  (---)(-)(-)    SR=0004   SSW=0729   Write Data= 42000000 ( )
Process Name: ImagineFP

    I post this mainly for your own information. I'll also contact Impulse
about it once I think I have it narrowed down some more. For now, I guess I'll
just change my scene around until it renders without dying again. Perhaps in
24-bit rather than HAM?

    Chris

##

Subject:     Re: Flashing anims
Date:        Fri, 10 Apr 92 10:29:58 -0400
From:        "Michael B. Comet" <[e-mail]>

>Hi, I just completed an anim with Imagine in anim format.  When I try to
>display the animimation I get a really strange flash when the animation
>loops.  I looked at the individual pictures and I don't have that problem.
>Please help.
>
>Joe Cotellese
>
>

    Sounds like you selected "NO" for make a looping anim?  If you
select no for this, then you will get this wierd palette flash at the
end of the loop.  Select "YES" for create a looping anim, and everything
should be fine.

                    Mike C.
                    [e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re: Enforcer hits w/Trace in 2.0
Date:        Fri, 10 Apr 92 8:34:49 MDT
From:        Steve Koren <[e-mail]
         ***.com>

> Imagine has been crashing and crashing HARD.

>     I remember some time back a few people where having problems rendering
> anims because Imagine wouldn't give back all the RAM when it finished a frame
.

I was one of the ones having this problem.  It has not, as far as I can
tell, been fixed in 2.0.  Also, Imagine 2.0 crashes on my system with a
frequency which makes it unusable.  (About 2 times out of 3, it crashes
immediately upon startup, and it crashes during rendering for the few
times that it does start up correctly.   It does this even if I boot
from a "raw" AmigaDos 2.04 disk with nothing else running.)

I have become quite disillusioned with the quality of the Imagine
software and the unprofessionalism of the documentation and the Impulse
newsletters.  Imagine has a lot of potential, and it is possible to
get good results from it, but there are so many problems that it is
not worth my time to do so.

The gross grammatical and spelling errors in their newsletters reek
of unprofessionalism.  It is almost as if they didn't care about the
impression this gives of their company.  When I read the Impulse
newsletters, I am reminded of the quality of writing that I have
seen grade school students produce.  It's not simply "imformal";
it is bordering on illiterate.

   - steve

##

Subject:     Re: Offer for club members/developers
Date:        Fri, 10 Apr 1992 15:33:30 GMT
From:        Stephen Menzies <[e-mail]>

[e-mail] (Stephen Menzies) writes:

>[stuff regarding the RCS offer deleted]

>With regards to whether or not this mailing list qualifies as a User
>Group, I don't know, but my *guess* is that it would. This mailing list
>does have a list of members (for starts).

>The deadline for this offer is May31,1992

I did a call the RCS regarding whether or not the RCS offer applied
to mailing lists (ie: imagine, dctv, lightwave..). Their answer is
yes, providing that a membership list exists or is maintained, the
member can prove his/her membership, and that the member is a US
resident (at this time anyway).

If you have any concerns or questions regarding the possibility of a
similar and future offer being made to those outside the US, please
call RCS directly:
Tel#[phone]
Fax#[phone]


>-stephen
>--
>Stephen Menzies
>#Internet: [e-mail]
>#Fidonet : Stephen Menzies @ 1:167/265
--
Stephen Menzies
#Internet: [e-mail]
#Fidonet : Stephen Menzies @ 1:167/265

##

Subject:     Re: Enforcer hits w/Trace in 2.0
Date:        Fri, 10 Apr 1992 11:33:41 -0400
From:        Greg Jones <[e-mail]>

=I was one of the ones having this problem.  It has not, as far as I can
=tell, been fixed in 2.0.  Also, Imagine 2.0 crashes on my system with a
=frequency which makes it unusable.  (About 2 times out of 3, it crashes
=immediately upon startup, and it crashes during rendering for the few
=times that it does start up correctly.   It does this even if I boot
=from a "raw" AmigaDos 2.04 disk with nothing else running.)
=

Perhaps the problem isn't in Imagine.  For years my Amiga 2000 system
would crash on DPaintIII about 1 of out 5 startups.  No other application
appeared to have this problem.  Finally, I determined that the RAM board
in my system was causing the problem.  The moral to this story, don't
be so quick to blame the software,  there may be a hidden hardware
problem that the instruction sequence in your application triggers.

I'm sure if the software was so broken that it crashed 2 out of 3 times
on startup this list would be in a constant uproar.

Greg Jones
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re: Enforcer hits w/Trace in 2.0
Date:        Fri, 10 Apr 92 10:10:56 MDT
From:        Steve Koren <[e-mail]
         ***.com>

> appeared to have this problem.  Finally, I determined that the RAM board
> in my system was causing the problem.  The moral to this story, don't

I have run several memory checks, and everything is OK.  I do have a
68040, and Imagine seems to have troubles with that.  If I turn off
the copyback cache, Imagine works OK.  With copyback cache on, it
crashes a lot.  Other software works right in either case.

> I'm sure if the software was so broken that it crashed 2 out of 3 times
> on startup this list would be in a constant uproar.

If it happened on every system, yes.  I think it's specific to 68040s,
or to some combination of things on my system.  At any rate, it's
annoying.

   - steve

##

Subject:     Fun Geometry Question!
Date:        Fri, 10 Apr 92 12:55:10 -0500
From:        Elizabeth E Sack <[e-mail]>

Okay Imagineers (is that like Mousekateers ?),
    It's time to strap on your 3D thinking caps and figure this out.

(these questions are taken from Arthur C Clarke's 'The Ghost of the Grand
Banks')


1)    You have two tetrahedrons (4 sided pyramid, all sides are equilateral
    triangles).  If you put these together, face to face, how many faces
    will the resulting geometric solid have?

2)    You have one tetrahedron and one pu pyramid (5 sides, square base,
    the 4 traingular sides are the same size equilateral triangle as a
    side on the tetrahedron).  If you put these together, triangular face
    to triangular face, how many sides does the resulting geometric solid
    have?


I'll post the answers on Monday.

Jeff Hanna
Studio J Video Productions

InterNet:  [e-mail]
GEnie:     J.HANNA5

##

Subject:     Re: Enforcer hits w/Trace in 2.0
Date:        Fri, 10 Apr 92 12:28:44 PDT
From:        "R. L. Zarling" <[e-mail]>

>From [e-mail] Fri Apr 10 08:37:13 1992
>
>I'm sure if the software was so broken that it crashed 2 out of 3 times
>on startup this list would be in a constant uproar.

Maybe if it were *that* broke, we would be.  But there can be no doubt,
to anyone who's followed this list for any length of time, that imagine
(and Silver before it) have always been quite buggy; the interface is
unnecessarily unintuitive; many things don't work the way one would
expect; and of course the manual has always contributed more to the
problem than the solution.

From a professional standpoint,  imagine is poorly programmed.  From
any standpoint, it is embarassingly poorly documented.  Support from
Impulse insults (literally) my intelligence.  Much of this it seems to
me would cost little or nothing to correct:  just develop a little more
professional attitude and respect for the Users.

It's too bad that this is still the best program of its kind on the
Amiga.

--Ray Zarling
  Professor of Computer Science
  Calif. State Univ. Stanislaus
  [e-mail]

##

Subject:     RE: Enforcer hits w/Trace in 2.0 - Impulse flame
Date:        Fri, 10 Apr 92 14:42:43 PDT
From:        [e-mail]

In addition to what Steve Koren and Ray Zarling wrote, I have another
consideration.

It would appear that Impulse is betting on Imagine for the PC to really
make them successful.  Unfortunately with the attitude we have all come to
expect from Impulse, they will probably fail.  I suspect users in PC land
won't be so accepting of Imagine's (Impulse's) faults.  Seriously, how many
apps in PC land (or any other platform) are considered the yardstick, yet
are as buggy and poorly documented and supported as Imagine?

The implication for us Amiga people, is that such a foundering could
eliminate Impulse entirely.  Has anyone ever suggested to Mike Halvorson
that he should subscribe to this list?  Sheesh, if he really wants to make
more money, make happy customers.  Obviously, he (they) are not doing this.

- Scott

##

Subject:     Anim -> back to pics
Date:        Sun, 12 Apr 1992 21:48:35 -0600
From:        HURTT CHRISTOPHER MICHAEL <[e-mail]>

    Ack! I've recently finished an anim in Overscan HiRes. And of course it
's
too s-s-s-slow. Unfortunatly due to my ever diminishing HD space I had Imagine
build the animation, rather than just rendering the frames and building it myse
lf.
Is there anyway I can rip the individual frames back out of the animation besid
es
using Dpaint? The anim is 2.6megs (90 frames) and I seriouslly doubt if I strip
ped
my 6meg system to the bone I could load up the whole anim.
    What would be great is if someone had a CLI util that would rip a speci
fied
frame out of an animation. Then I could write an Arexx program to rip out the f
rames
, pop 'em thru ADPro to scale them down, and rebuild the anim.

    Anyone know of such a life-saver or have any other ideas? Thanks!

    Chris

##

Subject:     Re: Anim -> back to pics
Date:        Mon, 13 Apr 92 12:44:37 MDT
From:        HURTT CHRISTOPHER MICHAEL <[e-mail]>

    Sorry about the horrible formatting on that last message. I spent a few
hours scouring the local BBSs and came across and program that will rip out
individual frames! It's called ATI (Anim to IFF) and though fairly old, works
like a champ under 2.04. It runs on WB and requires you enter input for each
frame you want out. So, it didn't really help my case out.
    What did save me was SplitANIM bundled with ANIMBuild and CombineANIM.
I was able to split the 2.6meg into 2 1.3meg anims and load them into Dpaint.

Moral(?): buy a bigger HD so you can always render every frame! :)

    Chris

ps- if anyone wants I'll put ATI on hubcap

##

Subject:     IMPORTANT (forwarded) RCS message
Date:        Tue, 14 Apr 1992 01:17:57 GMT
From:        Stephen Menzies <[e-mail]>

Message#1 is forwarded message direct from RCS to ALL present owners
of their Fusion40 board.

Message#2 is a forwarded message direct from RCS regarding the US
special offer and method of payment.

--------------------start of forwarded message#1------------------

Anyone with a Fusion40 who's socket U37 contains a lattice:
"GAL22V10-15LP" and is experiencing *any* problems at boot, random
crashes and very unstable operation with *6.2* motherboards, please
notify RCS immediately at:

Voice# 514-871-4924
Fax#   [phone]

This problem has been solved. The offending part needs to be changed.
RCS will ship the new part immediately!

Note that this message concerns all Fusion40 users with 6.2 motherboards
*everywhere*.

Thankyou for your patience.

-RCS Management.
-------------------------forwarded message#2--------------------

The following is in regards to the announced RCS Management Special
Offer to United States (only) Amiga club members and developers.

RCS Management *DOES* accept personal checks as payment. However the
the order cannot be shipped until the check has been cleared. This check
clearing time will be between 3-4 weeks. RCS is not responsible for
this delay. This *is* the time required for a US bank to clear a check.


RCS Management does NOT have a policy to deal with credit cards do to
fact that RCS is not a dealer and generally does sell directly to the
public. In otherwords, RCS is not set up to accept credit card payments.
As this is a limited time offer, RCS will not be setting-up to deal
with credit card payments at this time. RCS apologizes for any
inconvienience this may cause.

-RCS Management

----------------------end of all forwarded messages-----------------


The 3-4weeks required for a US check to pass is not an exaggeration. Last
October I brought back a check from Texas and it took the full 4 weeks
to pass.


-stephen
--
Stephen Menzies
#Internet: [e-mail]
#Fidonet : Stephen Menzies @ 1:167/265

##

Subject:     RCS Offer
Date:        Tue, 14 Apr 92 13:24:59 -0400
From:        Brian Bishop <[e-mail]>

  I called up RCS to get more info on the Fusion-40 offer. Basically he
confirmed that their notion of a usergroup is flexible enough to make our
mailing list eligible, as long as we can send them the name & number of the
leader of the list. So, Steve, is it OK if you start getting 100 phone calls
from Canada?

  Also, shipping is $50 overnight, $10 by ground. He said they don't have a
backlog of orders yet, but they did toward the end of a promotion they did
in Canada, hence the 3-5 week worst case figure. They include three math
libraries with the package: their original, CBM's, and a third that works
"5-20% better" with Lattice-compiled executables. The board can hold up to
32 meg, and you can populate as much of it as you want at $175/4 meg.


  Can someone who has one of these things comment on them???


   Brian

##

Subject:     Fusion 040 answers
Date:        Tue, 14 Apr 92 13:28:02 -0400
From:        Joe Kiniry <[e-mail]>

>Robert J. Jones says...

>The $995 price offer on the Fusion40 card is very appealing. When I told a
>friend of mine who had just purchased the Progressive Peripherals 040 card
>for $1895 he was a little surprised. But he did have a couple of questions
>(based on his knowledge of the Progressive Peripherals product)
>about the card that perhaps a Fusion40 owner could answer:
>
>        1. Does the F40 card use an interleaved memory architecture
>           for speed? (to support Burst mode)

Yes, it has interleaved memory.  (Supports burst mode fine.)

>        2. Is the memory on the card autoconfigurable? Or is a portion of
>           it autoconfigured and a portion out of the normal memory space?

Memory is _not_ autoconfig, it is outside of 'normal' memory space.

>        3. In 68000 mode do you keep the autoconfigured memory or does it
>           all disappear?

It all disappears.

>        4. Are Commodore Math libraries supplied with the board? Early
>           product news indicated that Fusion was using the Motorola libraries
>           rather than waiting for the Commordore software. (Does this make
>           a real difference?)

I don't know which libraries are in use, but I don't think it really matters.
RCS is releasing their own math libraries RSN (for a price) which are reported
to _significantly_ increase floating point speed. (That's why it's not free.)

>        5. Does the F40 support the copyback mode? (I'm told that 20% of
>           the 040 speed is in the copyback mode. Early reports had it that
>           the F40 at first did not support the copyback mode.)

Copyback mode is fully supported.  Most every program I've tried worked great w
ith
it on even during loading.

>None of these questions are intended to knock the F40 card, but the questions
>of interleaved memory and copyback mode goes directly to the heart of
>performance (I suspect that a non-interleaved design will be somewhat slower)
>and the question of memory autoconfiguration will point to how compatible the
>card is with your disk and other DMA device controllers. Losing all of the 32
>bit memory when in 68000 could really hurt, but I don't have any
>first hand knowledge about what products would need the 68000 mode to run.

Even though the 32 bit memory is outside the normal space it doesn't matter muc
h.
I have a friend with the AdSCSI board with his Fusion 40 and he gets disk trans
fer
rates from his Quantum and Maxtor very close to 1MB/sec.  Since DMA cannot be
supported of course then I guess a CPU/interrupt technique is utilized and sinc
e
you have an 040 you get great rates.  Of course, this is to the detriment of ot
her
tasks during that 1 or 2 seconds.  I don't know what would happen if you had a
controller which exclusively supported DMA, probably it would be god-awful slow
like in the old MidgetRacers.  My friend just received an upgrade recently (fre
e
software with a 28MHz crystal to put on the board) and it sped things up once a
gain.
RCS is continually releasing upgrades to the software for the Fusion 40, they
seem to really support the board well.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
I do not speak for RCS, nor am I even a customer.  I have some experience with
their
board and I have experience with the Amiga/Hardware/CPUs/etc.  That's all folks
!

---joe
[e-mail]

PS. You can reach the guy that owns the board at [e-mail] and
    he'd be happy to field direct, specific questions.

##

Subject:     UPDATE on RCS offer
Date:        Wed, 15 Apr 1992 17:41:01 GMT
From:        Stephen Menzies <[e-mail]>

This is a forwarded message direct from RCS Management regarding
their special offer on the Fusion40 board and the subject of US
club membership (clarification):

--------------------start of forwarded message (summary)-----------

Members (anywhere) of clubs BASED in the United States ARE eligible
for the special offer. This includeds clubs such as Victor Osaka's
(formerly TurboSig) 3D club etc.., special electronic mailling
lists (ie: Imagine, DCTV, Lightwave etc..) or any other "club" whose
headquarters, base machine.., are located in the US.

The "club" must maintain a membership list and the "member" must be
able to prove his/her membership.


--------------------------end of forwarded message----------------

The problem became readily apparent when RCS started to receive a lot
of calls from "members" outside of the US and in fairness to all, phoned
me with this clarification.

If there are any questions, please, either phone/fax RCS directly or
leave a message in this newsgroup/mailing list if it would appear
to be of interest to many. Please do NOT send me e-mail (if possible).

RCS : voice# 514-871-4924
        fax# [phone]



Thankyou..

-stephen

--
Stephen Menzies
#Internet: [e-mail]
#Fidonet : Stephen Menzies @ 1:167/265

##

Subject:     mail list VS newsgroup
Date:        Thu, 16 Apr 92 10:08:48 EST
From:        "Steve J. Lombardi" <[e-mail]>

Howdy- I've been away for a few weeks and come back to findthat this
very informative maillist may be moving to a newsgroup. I think
this is a great idea with many pros and few cons. I like the
idea of keeping my mailbox uncluttered. There seems to be enough
discussion here to justify a newsgroup. I think this would open the
dialog up to more people from varying software backgrounds. anyway,
thats my 2cents on the subject.

As an aside. I'm sure a lot of imaginers who use dctv to  play their
animations will find this useful. When the screen changes in an
anim become so large as to bog down the anim or PFX formats,I often
flip the frames with the directorII from right answers. on my 9 meg
machine I can preload about 130 3bit non laced screens and flip them
at about 20fps. (about 6 seconds worth of motion) anyway... a readme
file on the director disk reveals that wipes and blits can be
performed on two dctv screens as long as you move 4 pixel blocks.
I was totally unaware of this. after a bit of trial and error,
I was dong all sorts of 2d transitions, simulated a-b rolls etc...
A nice post production enhancement for your IMAGINEations.

--
steve
[e-mail]

ps - I have a cando deck that I routinely use to convert files
to dctv format and simultaneously create Director scripts. Of
course you'll still need to own the Director to play them back.
If anyone is interested I'll upload it somewhere.... let me know.

##

Subject:     How does grow work?
Date:        Fri, 17 Apr 92 15:21:51 EDT
From:        George Browning <[e-mail]>

I am still using Imagine 1.x.  In the addedum pages that come with it it talks
about the grow affect.  It says to do something like 'make a path in the detail
editor using points, not Axis' and to group the resulting path to a flat.
object.  Well I spent quite a while rereading the manuals, and trying
everything I could think of to follow the directions.  I usually ended up
getting a bunch of error messages about 'non existent path' etc when I added
the grow effect to my compound object in the stage editor...  How do I do
it????

Any hints would be appreciated,
George
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re:  RCS FusionForty for << $$
Date:        Fri, 17 Apr 92 19:53:38 CDT
From:        [e-mail]

The decision to move the fusion forty kinda depends on what applications
you do normally on your amiga.  I am about 80% of the way to completing
an installation of a FF40 on my 2000.  First there are the configuration
issuses.
You have GVP combo so I am assuming you use its on board hard drive
controller.  So moving to the fusion forty will require you to use
a differnt hd interface.  The 2091 will work but it really requires
version 6.9 of the controller roms to wrok well.  The hard frame doesn't
work as far as I know.  Generally dma interfaces arn't optimal with the 040
(mainly due to large inst/data caches).  Processor I/O interfaces work
pretty good because they avoid most of the cache probs, so IVS
trumpcard, old supra, old gvp, old cltd will wokr(currently I have
an old cltd because it works under 1.3).
Second if you do get the ff40 get a 2.0 rom.  No way around it.  If
you try to use it under 1.3 you will loose a good deal of sleep, and
work.  Software is just plain flaky under 1.3 with an 040. (I just got
mine today).
So how fast is it really, or more accuralty how fast does it feel, well
I my experience so far has all been under 1.3 and my basis for comparison
has been my 1000 with 16MHz lucas/frances).  If you can get the board
to remap kickstart to 32bit ram and work reliably the general feel
of the machine (pointing clicking, moving windows, response to your
input, etc.) will really reaally jump.  All that other sped increase
stuff the advertisments only comes into play when you are cranking away math.
The bootleneck is the graphics chips/chip ram and when you
interfacting with the machine the rom and chip ram are being used.

So now if you use your machine to ray tracing where you arn't actually
doing anything the board will do a lot better than the gvp otherwise
it will fell about the same.

There are still pd utils and similar software that isn't 040 friendly.
the easy way around this is to turn off the copyback mode and the data cache.
Now these things work but you have given up a good deal of the edge the
040 gives you over the gvp.

If you would like to run utils like memmung or enforcer and the like
you can't because the 040 has a slightly differnt MMU than the gvp.  These
programs are generally only useful to developers os this might not be a
concern.  For the same reason you can't run amax.

All these catches will/may change as time goes on. RCS has hinted
that they may offer their own hard drive interface that sits
on the 040 card like the gvp which will solve problems.  They
have also hinted that they mayoffer an option where the 040
can talk to the chip ram at 040 speeds.

Lastly the memory for the 040 isn't autoconfig.  You have to run
a bit of software in your startup-sequence to bring up the 32 bit ram and
turn on the 040's caches.

A couple of months back amiga world did a review of the available 040 boards
speed wise they are all pretty close.  The ff40 has been out the longest,
however the software that allows the board to run under 1.3 has not
impressed me(to be fair the board really should be run under 2.0 as
all the other 040 boards require it).  A good quote from the article
was .. this is the cutting edge of technology, though some would say
the bleeding edge. ... if you need the computational speed
this is the fastest option.

  have fun
Brian Leair
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Imagine crashes and burns
Date:        Sun, 19 Apr 92 20:22:07 EDT
From:        [e-mail]

This sounds awfully surreal.

I'm trying to trace a very large scene, requiring on the order of 12 Megabytes.
The trace sets up normally, and when it gets 30% through, my SYS: device
VANISHES. The icon even disappears from the workbench.

From then on, I get 2-3 second pauses and occasionally other devices vanish,
like ram: and cdh0:. Eventually, the machine does a 2.0 not-guru.

I've never seen this problem before, and I've since run every virus checker
I could find with nothing detected. My Imagine 2.0 binary is 595636 bytes
long, and is the same length as one I unarced off my distribution disk.

Any ideas what might be up? The machine is an 18meg 3000 running 2.04.

Moo
Frank Branham

##

Subject:     Re:  RCS FusionForty for << $$
Date:        Mon, 20 Apr 92 00:58:14 -0400
From:        Baird Lynn <[e-mail]>

Has anyone bought the new Zeus card from PP yet? I heard that it's selling in t
he range of $10,000 right now. PP either must be trying to offset the price for
 the SCSI-2 implementation or that card must really fly to cost that much.
If anyone seen the card in operation, leave a reply. Those SCSI-2 drives 10Mb/s
ec must be excellent for Toaster operation.. It could be just the thing for
realtime 24 bit animation. (a little slow but acceptable).

##

Subject:     Sourceless chrome...
Date:        Mon, 20 Apr 92 2:18:39 PDT
From:        "Daryl T. Bartley" <[e-mail]>

Just a quick question...is there a quick and easy way (ie attributes/etc.) to
get that kind of 'sourceless' chrome effect I keep seeing on TV? You know how
it looks chrome-like, without actually reflecting anything...Just wondering.

Also, is there some quick&dirty method for making 'classic wireframe' anims?
The triangular faces in the imagine-made wireframes just don't look right
somehow, and I wanted to get the grid-style wireframe. I was considering a
brushmap of a green grid, with a transparency map to make the spaces between
the lines see-through...would this work? Is there a way to do it with the
Grid texture? Please let me know.

A t D h V a A n N k C s E,

Daryl Bartley
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re: Sourceless chrome...
Date:        Mon, 20 Apr 92 10:10:58 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

> Just a quick question...is there a quick and easy way (ie attributes/etc.) to
> get that kind of 'sourceless' chrome effect I keep seeing on TV? You know how
> it looks chrome-like, without actually reflecting anything...Just wondering.

Most all reflection you see in 3D animation on television is done with
reflection maps. Just take a digitized picture of a nice outdoor landscape
(50% sky, 50% ground) and use it as a reflected image. This will create a
very nice looking chrome. Its a good idea to use a picture that doesn't have
any real eye catching elements in it as they may show up in your chrome
and look goofy. Nearly no one in the production world uses ray-traced
reflection.
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Brush mapping help
Date:        Mon, 20 Apr 92 12:31:15 -0400
From:        [e-mail]

I am using brushmaps for the first time and have had some problems.  I
read Steve Worley's tutorial on brushmapping, and am still confused
about what to do about the Y axis.  I mapped an image of face to the
side of a square cube.  It was a simple color map.  I only wanted the
face to appear on one side of the cube.  The results were quite
dramatic, but not what I expected.  The face continued through the
depth of the cube to the other side (with face reversed on the other
side and very grainey).  The two other sides of the cube were even
more interesting (and maybe too hard to describe).  These sides
recorded the edges of the face image as it moved from the front of the
cube to the back (very colorful -- it looked like a photo of an object
at great speed passing in front of fixed camera -- a kind of blurring
effect).  Anyway, what happened, was that I did not set the Y axis
depth correctly.  But every time I tried to scale on the Y axis when I
was creating the color map, it just stretched out like an elastic band
from its origin in the middle of the cube.  How do I control the depth
of the brush map so that it only appears on one face of the cube?

Also, once I figure out how to control the depth, how do I set it so
that only the face of the cube and not the adjacent sides get mapped.
In its current state, the cube had color from the map on all four
sides.  Even if I scaled the Y axis so that I was very very small,
won't part of the brush map show on the two adjacent sides of the
cube?  Do you have to enter the numbers for the Y axis manually using
the transformation (?) requester vs EDIT BRUSH? Say, for example, I wanted
to have face1 on one side of the cube, another face on the side opposite,
and the some lettering on the other two sides.  What would keep the
brushmaps from interferring on the Y axis with each other?

Rich Nollman

##

Subject:     Re: RCS FusionForty for << $$
Date:        Mon, 20 Apr 92 16:54:24 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

> Has anyone bought the new Zeus card from PP yet? I heard that it's selling
> in the range of $10,000 right now. PP either must be trying to offset the
> price for the SCSI-2 implementation or that card must really fly to cost
> that much.

I think you are confusing this board with some other. I was told that it would
list for approximately $2900 with 0K memory and no disk. To fully configure
it with say 64MB of RAM and a 500MB fast SCSI-2 drive, you are getting up
around $8K.

> If anyone seen the card in operation, leave a reply. Those
> SCSI-2 drives 10Mb/sec must be excellent for Toaster operation.. It could
> be just the thing for realtime 24 bit animation. (a little slow but
> acceptable).

If you could actually achieve 10MB/s continuous transfer, a 15fps Toaster
animation would be possible. In my last conversation with PP however, they
said they were only achieving around 8.3MB/s and that the Amiga OS was to
blame. But even if you could get 10MB/s transfers, you are still going to be
limited by the bus transfers from 32bit RAM to Toaster display memory and
I don't believe you can achieve anywhere near 10MB/s there.

As for seeing a board in operation, I am told they will not be showing it
off at WOC in NYC simply because PP will not be there. However, I am slated
to receive the first board that they ship, which should be about a week
from now, and I'll let ya know what I think.
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Re: Brush mapping help
Date:        Mon, 20 Apr 92 19:22:41 EDT
From:        Dan Drake <[e-mail]>

I was doing the same things with brushmaps on a cube, and here is what
I did:

construct the cube from planes, and put a brushmap on each plane.
Set the y axis size of the map to 1.

dan.

##

Subject:     Re: Sourceless chrome...
Date:        Mon, 20 Apr 92 19:28:57 EDT
From:        Dan Drake <[e-mail]>

Mark,

> Most all reflection you see in 3D animation on television is done with
> reflection maps.
Is this image mapped on an object, or does the object have reflection set
way up, so that it reflects the necessary amount of the spectrum so it looks
real?

.
.
.

> Nearly no one in the production world uses ray-traced
> reflection.
Again, can you explain what you mean in a litle more detail?

thanks,

dan.

##

Subject:     040 customer support
Date:        Mon, 20 Apr 92 16:50:06 -0700
From:        [e-mail]

 Hi all. Just wanted to relate a little story I had with PP&S and their
Mercury A3000 accelorator board. If any of you out ther are considering an
'040 board and customer support is a concern, I can wholeheartedly endorse
PP&S. Their tech guy called me back so I wouldn't have to pay the charges,
and went through several different possibilities with me. When we finally weren
't
able to get it to work, PP&S picked up the tab to send the board out to them vi
a
fed ex. next day delivery, where they will either fix the board or send me a ne
w
one within a 24 hour period, and next day fed ex it back. If I had to buy somet
hing
that didn't work, I couldn't have asked for better service.

I am not affiliated with PP&S in any way, and do not gain anything from anyway
buying their products. I'll post a review of it when I have a working model.

  ___________________________________________________________________________
 /  [e-mail]                                       |     //         \
|Oh, you're just gettin weird...and that results in creativ-|    //Only Amiga |
|ity" -Joel MST3K|Virtual Reality is the future of safe sex.|\\ //  makes it  |
 \__________________________________________________________|_\X/___possible_/

##

Subject:     Thanks all
Date:        Mon, 20 Apr 92 18:18:26 PDT
From:        "Daryl T. Bartley" <[e-mail]>

thanks for all the help on the chrome, folks. Been playing around with it a
bit and got some really killer chrome effects. (that article by AGW in the
video ish of amiga world helped too).

As to the 'classic' wireframe thing, I got that working too.
As to what I meant, I was talking about the sort of wireframe you see on the
computer displays on TV/movies/etc...a square grid rather than triangles.
At any rate, I got the look I wanted...pretty keen.

On a related note, I was working on a transition where a 'wireframe' object
changes into a fully shaded object...I was using a linear texture on both
objects, and flying it across the two in opposite directions (ie the linear
was set to invisible, so one object faded in while the other faded out). Got so
me strange results however, due to the objects overlapping. Is there a way
around this without having to take the objects apart section by section?

Of course, if I have acheived my usual level of incomprehensibility, let me
know and I'll try to clarify.

Thanks again for the help.

Daryl Bartley
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Port of Renderman
Date:        Tue, 21 Apr 92 01:46:54 -0700
From:        George Hepker <[e-mail]>

I recieved an interesting letter from Pixar:

Dear George,

I recieved your letter today requesting information about the
possibility of a port of RenderMan to the Amiga.  As you might
imagine we have had many requests to undertake this port.

With the advent of machines like the 2500 and 3000 and new third
party video cards that supported true-color displays, porting
RenderMan might finally be feasible.  We have Amiga computers in
house, and will be doing some testing in the coming months.  Please
keep in touch and I'll try to keep you informed of progress with
the Amiga computer.

Sincerely,

Ray Davis,
Manager Third Party Support
----------------------------------------------------------------
George Hepker     [e-mail]
.sig

##

Subject:     Crash and burn on filter maps
Date:        Tue, 21 Apr 92 09:17:01 EDT
From:        [e-mail]

I tried a VERY simple trace this morning. The scene consisted of a 100x100
plane with a filter map on it, and 2 lights.

The trace died at 16%, which is about where it would start hitting the object.
The symptoms are the same as yesterday.

The map I was using was created with Imagemaster. I was able to trace another
map on the same object, and I was able to trace with the Imagemaster-iff
set to be a color map instead of a filter.

Has anyone else seen any sort of weirdness with the origin of an IFF in
imagine?

Moo
Frank Branham

##

Subject:     Re: Sourceless chrome...
Date:        Tue, 21 Apr 92 09:45:56 EDT
From:        "Bob Lindabury, SysAdm" <[e-mail]>

rutgers!cs.pitt.edu!dan (Dan Drake) writes:

> Mark,
>
> > Most all reflection you see in 3D animation on television is done with
> > reflection maps.
> Is this image mapped on an object, or does the object have reflection set
> way up, so that it reflects the necessary amount of the spectrum so it looks
> real?

I believe the reflection setting of the object is set by you to be
whatever you wish for a reflective percentage (1-100%).  The object
then reflects the image as if it were a global reflection map.  At
least this is how it seems to work in Lightwave.  If it were a
projection I would imagine you would have to pick a type of
projection for the map to look right on the object.

> .
> .
> .
>
> > Nearly no one in the production world uses ray-traced
> > reflection.
> Again, can you explain what you mean in a litle more detail?
>
> thanks,
>
> dan.

Most large studios use reflection mapping and solid modeling and not
raytracing due to the tremendous overhead and time required to trace
high-resolution images.  In most cases (if the mapping is done
correctly) you can hardly tell the difference.  Refraction is another
matter however..<grin>

-- Bob

 The Graphics BBS  908/469-0049  "It's better than a sharp stick in the eye!"
 ============================================================================
  InterNet: [e-mail]                | Raven Enterprises
      UUCP: ...rutgers!bobsbox!graphics!bobl      | 25 Raven Avenue
    BitNet: bobl%graphics.rent.com@pucc           | Piscataway, NJ 08854
    Home #: 908/560-7353                          | 908/271-8878

##

Subject:     In Search of Objects
Date:        Tue, 21 Apr 92 09:13:49 CDT
From:        Wayne Haufler 283-4160 <[e-mail]>

Does anyone know where I can get an Imagine object of one or a pair of
cowboy or western boot(s)?  How about a Capitol Dome object?  You know,
the dome on top of the U.S. Capitol building?
I haven't looked very hard yet.  Thanks.


         __      Wayne A. Haufler   [Christian/SW Engineer/XWindows/Amigan]
\\ /\\ /\\ //_    [e-mail]    McDonnell Douglas-Houston
 \/--\// \//__    Hobby:"Exploring the Use of Computer Graphics and
     //                  Animations To Support Christian Endeavors"

##

Subject:     digitizing tablets
Date:        Tue, 21 Apr 92 15:04:41 EDT
From:        Alan Price <[e-mail]>

Howdy,
I asked this question a while ago, but there are a lot of new voices
on the list so I'll ask again:
I'm looking for drivers to run either an HP SketchPro or a Summagraphics
SummaSketch Plus drawing tablet on my Amiga 3000. There are stacks of these
things lying around at work collecting dust. If anyone can direct me to
a source for these or even write one I would be very interested in working
out a deal. ($$)
AP.

##

Subject:     What kind of BOZO would ask about extrude to path AGAIN!?
Date:        Tue, 21 Apr 92 17:57:49 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

Well I have have been reading and posting to this list since its inception
and now I am finally going to ask a question....One of the more frequently
asked questions I see here is how to extrude to a path. I have seen it
answered countless times but now I need to know if you can load an object
as your path. I want to extrude two concentric circles along the closed
edge created by Pixel 3D when auto tracing text or other bitmaps. The end
goal is to be able to easily create simulated neon signs of scanned
silhouettes. The inner extruded tube would be the neon and the outer is the
glow (which will be no problem in LightWave). So can extrude to path be
used this way? My understanding was that the path had to be created in
Imagine which I do not wish to do, I just want to perform the extrusion there.
Would you believe this was one of the only reasons I picked up a copy of
Imagine?
%~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~%
%      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  %
% --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   %
%      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   %
%     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   %
%                                                                          %
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Re:  What kind of BOZO would ask about extrude to path AGAIN!?
Date:        Wed, 22 Apr 92 09:03:35 -0400
From:        "ESTES,JON-PAUL" <[e-mail]>

I do not know if this can be done with an object created from Pixel 3D, but
I will try it tonight.  However, you might try using Imagine's built-in
text to object function (this is in 2.0).  When Imagine asks you if you want
faces, say no.  This will give you just the outline, which should be
made up of lines and points.  This is the type of "path" that extrude to path
uses (not a real spline path).  Name this outline PATH (or remember to
change the name of the path to be extruded to) and try it.  I will also try
this tonight.  Seems like it will work.  The reason I am not sure about
Pixel is that it always fills in the faces.  If there is someway to get it
to just do outlines then it should work as well, but I don't know of a
way offhand of making it do this.  I will post my results tomorrow.

-- Jon-Paul Estes

##

Subject:     Re:  What kind of BOZO would ask about extrude to path AGAIN!?
Date:        Wed, 22 Apr 92 09:15:10 EDT
From:        [e-mail]

In Imagine 2.0, I think you HAVE to use a spline path.

but if you still have 1.1--or even Turbo Silver, you can do that, AS LONG
as Pixel 3D makes the points linearly numbered.

I doubt you'll have much problem.

Moo
Frank

##

Subject:     Winners at LA AmiExpo Art and Video contest???
Date:        Wed, 22 Apr 92 17:23:30 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

Anyone know who won in the various categories (1st, 2nd, and 3rd)???
I just received notice from Supra that they are sending me a Syquest
drive for winning the Animation category. But the winners were announced
at the show and I just found out now. Anybody have a list of who won?
Here is the original list of categories:

Commercial Video
1st Place - A Video Toaster from NewTek, Inc.
2nd Place - Pixel 3D 2.0 from Axiom Software
3rd Place - A One Year Subscription to AmigaWorld Magazine

Commercial Still
1st Place - A Dozen Photographic Print Transfers from ASDG, Inc.
2nd Place - Art Department Professional from ASDG, Inc.
3rd Place - A One Year Subscription to AmigaWorld Magazine

Mixed Media Video
1st Place - A ChromaKey from MicroSearch
2nd Place - ShowMaker from Gold Disk, Inc.
3rd Place - A One Year Subscription to AmigaWorld Magazine

Two Dimensional Image
1st Place - A Impact Vision 24 from Great Valley Products
2nd Place - DesignWorks from New Horizons
3rd Place - A One Year Subscription to AmigaWorld Magazine

Three Dimensional Image
1st Place - An 68040 Accelerator from Great Valley Products
2nd Place - Vista Pro from Virtual Reality Laboratories
3rd Place - A One Year Subscription to AmigaWorld Magazine

Mixed Media Image
1st Place - DCTV from Digital Creations, Inc.
2nd Place - RasterLink  from Active Circuits, Inc.
3rd Place - A One Year Subscription to AmigaWorld Magazine

Animation
1st Place - A SupraDrive Removable Syquest Drive from Supra Corp.
2nd Place - Imagine from Impulse, Inc.
3rd Place - A One Year Subscription to AmigaWorld Magazine

%~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~%
%      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  %
% --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   %
%      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   %
%     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   %
%                                                                          %
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Re:  digitizing tablets
Date:        Wed, 22 Apr 92 16:43:02 CDT
From:        Dave Wickard <[e-mail]>

Alan Price asks about getting a driver for his SummaSketch tablet.

I would like to get this also... as I remember...this thing is
an 8bit serial with 1 Stop bit.

It would be nice to use this thing alright.  :-)
Alan, if anyone knows of this driver...or is willing to create it...
or even if someone gets a few of them...and is willing to share the
cost of creating one for us to use... lemme know.

David G. Wickard                        Coming to you LIVE from UNISYS
[phone]                          where our motto is...
[e-mail]                 "Fire em if they can't take a joke."
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re:  digitizing tablets
Date:        Thu, 23 Apr 92 8:03:52 EDT
From:        Dan Drake <[e-mail]>

> Alan Price asks about getting a driver for his SummaSketch tablet.
>
> I would like to get this also... as I remember...this thing is
> an 8bit serial with 1 Stop bit.
>
> It would be nice to use this thing alright.  :-)
> Alan, if anyone knows of this driver...or is willing to create it...
> or even if someone gets a few of them...and is willing to share the
> cost of creating one for us to use... lemme know.
>
> David G. Wickard                        Coming to you LIVE from UNISYS
> [phone]                          where our motto is...
> [e-mail]                 "Fire em if they can't take a joke."
> [e-mail]
>

A couple years ago, we were looking at hooking a sketch pad up to a sun.
We never did get it completely working, but with a little experimentation
the codes sent from the tablet were pretty easy to figure out. If I remember
correctly, it sent a signal byte and the X and Y position of the current
coordinate.  There was a seperate code sent for when the button on the
pen was pushed.  You could probably write the interface in Amiga Basic in
a couple of days.

dan.

##

Subject:     Extruding an object around another (sort of)
Date:        Thu, 23 Apr 92 09:16:39 -0400
From:        "ESTES,JON-PAUL" <[e-mail]>

Well, last night I tried using Imagine 2.0's built in text to object
conversion and using this as a path.  After a couple of tries, here are
the results.  You can type in your text, hit the OK button, wait, answer
no to the "fill in the object with faces" requestor, and rename the
object PATH.  This gives you an outline that EXTRUDE uses as a path.
Don't use EXTRUDE, however.  Use REPLICATE!  Pick the object that you
want to replicate, select MOLD, then select REPLICATE.  In the requestor,
select ALONG PATH, and enter a larger enough number in the space for number
of times to be replicated (just experiment to get this right).  There is
only one problem with this method, the PATH object is a double outline.
In other words, there is a trace along the inside edge of the font, and along
the outside edge.  The only way to get rid of this that I know of is to
go to PICK POINTS, and delete the ones you don't want.  If the PATH object
is not too large, this is not a big deal, but it could get out of hand
real quick.  The reason I said do not use EXTRUDE is because that it does not
work!  No matter how many sections you tell it to include, you only get 2,
one at the first point, and one at the last.  REPLICATE works just fine.
I don't know if it will give you exactly what you are looking for, but
it sure is a neat feature.  Real3D has this built in, where it can build
an object out of an IFF with another object.  Now instead of just mirrored
spheres, you can make logos out of mirrored spheres!  You just have to go
through a little more in Imagine to do the same thing.  I dont'
know if I helped any, but I hope so.

As far as Pixel3D goes, I needed sleep and didn't get to try it.  You should
get the same results if it will allow you to not put in faces, however.
I just don't think it has that option.

-- Jon-Paul Estes

##

Subject:     bad chunk size
Date:        Thu, 23 Apr 92 11:36:17 EDT
From:        "John J. Rosner" <[e-mail]>

I used Pixel 3D to convert Mark's head from Lightwave to Imagine but in
trying to load into Imagine it gave me a message like bad chunk size.  I
hadn't seen this since pre 2.0 of Imagine, surely someone else has tried to
put Mark back together.  Any ideas?
Later John Rosner

##

Subject:     LA Amiga Contest? etc...
Date:        Thu, 23 Apr 92 13:25:14 -0400
From:        "Michael B. Comet" <[e-mail]>

    Okay, I am somewhat confused now.  I unfortunately don't have
the latest AmigaWorld (I think my subscription may have just expired)

    Is this contest going on now, or is it already over?

    Either way, does anyone know of any other contests that would
take either anims or still frames on S-VHS or VHS or take the amiga disks
for anims or art contests?

    Also, if this LA thingy is still going, how many entries are
allowed per person, and is there a fee?

    Thanks ahead of time!

               Michael Comet
               [e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re: bad chunk size
Date:        Thu, 23 Apr 92 15:05:25 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

John J. Rosner writes:
> I used Pixel 3D to convert Mark's head from Lightwave to Imagine but in
> trying to load into Imagine it gave me a message like bad chunk size.
> surely someone else has tried to put Mark back together.

Yeah, all the kings horses and all the kings men, but....
I'll give it a try tonight.
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Re: bad chunk size
Date:        Fri, 24 Apr 92 11:41:36 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

John J. Rosner writes:
> I used Pixel 3D to convert Mark's head from Lightwave to Imagine but in
> trying to load into Imagine it gave me a message like bad chunk size.

Well I tried it last night and had the same problem. However, I then tried
it with a beta copy if InterChange Plus and it worked like a champ.
InterChange also created a smaller file than Pixel3D but both where over
double the size of the LightWave version. I will upload it to hubcap
in the Imagine object directory as MarkHeadIm.lzh but you will still need
to get the image map from the original LightWave version archive.
%~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~%
%      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  %
% --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   %
%      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   %
%     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   %
%                                                                          %
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Re: bad chunk size
Date:        Fri, 24 Apr 92 13:35:04 EDT
From:        Steve Pietrowicz <modcomp![e-mail]>

> Mark,
>
> Any idea when the new InterChange Plus will be released?
>
> mark davis
> [e-mail]
>
The folks at Syndesis are still working on InterChange Plus...no firm
date yet, though.  There's gonna be lots of stuff in there, so there
has been a lot to test.


Steve

##

Subject:     Re: What kind of BOZO would ask about extrude to path AGAIN!?
Date:        Fri, 24 Apr 92 17:55:14 CST
From:        James Hastings-Trew <telepro![e-mail]>

In a message dated Thu 23 Apr 92 22:30, Mark Thompson <[e-mail].c
wrote:

 MT> Well I have have been reading and posting to this list since its
 MT> inception
 MT> and now I am finally going to ask a question....One of the more
 MT> frequently
 MT> asked questions I see here is how to extrude to a path. I have seen
 MT> it
 MT> answered countless times but now I need to know if you can load an
 MT> object
 MT> as your path. I want to extrude two concentric circles along the
 MT> closed

Yes. Add an axis, and select MAKE PATH. Then load your object. Select the
path axis, and then your object, and JOIN then. You can now extrude on the
object path. Normal worries about sorting the path points/edges apply.

-- Via DLG Pro v0.992

##

Subject:     Re: In Search of Objects
Date:        Fri, 24 Apr 92 23:55:55 GMT
From:        Yury German <[e-mail]>

Hi Wayne Haufler 283-4160, in <[e-mail] > on Ap
r 21 you wrote:

: Does anyone know where I can get an Imagine object of one or a pair of
: cowboy or western boot(s)?  How about a Capitol Dome object?  You know,
: the dome on top of the U.S. Capitol building?
: I haven't looked very hard yet.  Thanks.
    Why not create the objects yoursef. Its not so hard to create a
capital dome building. Besides you can get the most satisfaction out of it
when you do it yourself.
    _____________________________________________________________________
   |                                                                     |
   | Yury German                  yury@bknight or [e-mail]   |
   | Blue-Knight Productions      GENIE EMAIL: Blue-Knight               |
   | [phone]                (Graphic Design and Video Productions) |
   | [phone]          P.O. Box 985, Queens, New York, 11354  |
   |_____________________________________________________________________|

##

Subject:     Re: digitizing tablets
Date:        Sat, 25 Apr 92 00:05:55 GMT
From:        Yury German <[e-mail]>

Hi Alan Price, in <[e-mail]> on Apr 21 you wrote:

: on the list so I'll ask again:
: I'm looking for drivers to run either an HP SketchPro or a Summagraphics
: SummaSketch Plus drawing tablet on my Amiga 3000. There are stacks of these
: things lying around at work collecting dust. If anyone can direct me to
: a source for these or even write one I would be very interested in working
: out a deal. ($$)

    Well for Suma Graphics I would just call the company for a driver.
They have the drivers and will probably sell it to you for a modest price!
    _____________________________________________________________________
   |                                                                     |
   | Yury German                  yury@bknight or [e-mail]   |
   | Blue-Knight Productions      GENIE EMAIL: Blue-Knight               |
   | [phone]                (Graphic Design and Video Productions) |
   | [phone]          P.O. Box 985, Queens, New York, 11354  |
   |_____________________________________________________________________|

##

Subject:     problems with grow
Date:        Sat, 25 Apr 92 02:11:05 +0200
From:        Hannes Heckner <[e-mail]>

Hi imagine freaks,

i have got big problems with the F/X Grow. Everytime I use this effect I
get one of these anoying gurus. I grouped an opened path and a plane together.
Then I added grow in the action editor. But all I get is a guru and yes I
selected first the path and then the plane while grouping together.

Help needed !!!!!!!

Thanx

P.S.: I am writing on a big wishlist for Imagine V3.0 (4.0). Will the people
from Impulse get this list when I put this list into this maillist ?

##

Subject:     Re: Caligari vs. Imagine
Date:        Sat, 25 Apr 92 00:31:30 GMT
From:        Yury German <[e-mail]>

Hi Mike Danielsen, in <[e-mail]> on Apr 22 you wrote:

: Caligari 2, which is about $250 mail order, produces excellent quality
: images on my DCTV. You must be thinking of the old Caligari.
    Nope thinking of the new Caligary 2. It is a nice program but
definately not the PRO version. Even though I know the owner/programer I
have to say that Caligary 2 does not compare to Imagine. Not even close!
:
: Imagine is a pain you learn to live with. (an embarassing unfriendly
: program in a world of user friendly software)
:
: Caligari is a joy to use and this allows you to be more creative.
    Well Caligary might seem easier to use... but Imagine is just tooo
powerful for it. I can run rings around Caligary with Imagine. Producing
output and pictures and anims that will rival alot of things.


    Mike obviously you love Caligary... so I am not going to argue
with you on that point! I personaly have tried both... and I definately
prefer Imagine.

    _____________________________________________________________________
   |                                                                     |
   | Yury German                  yury@bknight or [e-mail]   |
   | Blue-Knight Productions      GENIE EMAIL: Blue-Knight               |
   | [phone]                (Graphic Design and Video Productions) |
   | [phone]          P.O. Box 985, Queens, New York, 11354  |
   |_____________________________________________________________________|

##

Subject:     Re: problems with f/x grow
Date:        Sat, 25 Apr 92 02:26:54 CST
From:        Marc Couch <[e-mail]>

I am not sure if anyone at Impulse will read this.. But I tell ya what.. Let's
get a list of things together and I can compile em all together and send em off
 to Impulse!

Just finished a 7 meg 100 frame anim.. Nice.. lots of chrome..

Til Next Time..

Marc

BTW: Spread this mailing list around.. let's get it rolling

##

Subject:     what is cyberscanning ?
Date:        Sun, 26 Apr 1992 19:28 EST
From:        [e-mail]

Does anyone know anything about "cyberscanning" ?  It seems to
have something to do with scanning real three dimensional
objects, and creating 3d object files from the data gathered
thereby.  Does such a scanning device exist ?  If so, where is
it available ?  What does it cost ?
___________________________________________________________________
                  |         Internet: [e-mail]
Joe Hart          |     ///    Plink: OSS542
Niagara Falls, NY | \\\///  Ham call: WA2SND
                  |  \XX/   AMIGA - Computers for REAL MEN
===================================================================

##

Subject:     Re: what is cyberscanning ?
Date:        Mon, 27 Apr 92 10:57:47 -0400
From:        "Michael B. Comet" <[e-mail]>

>Does anyone know anything about "cyberscanning" ?  It seems to
>have something to do with scanning real three dimensional
>objects, and creating 3d object files from the data gathered
>thereby.  Does such a scanning device exist ?  If so, where is
>it available ?  What does it cost ?
>  Joe Hart
>

    I beleive this was used for T2 and such by ILM.  It involves
using a laser to actually scan an object as it rotates 360 degress to
get all the info.  Besides creating an object it can also give the
objectthe proper color.

    I forget what company makes the device, I beleive one of the
amiga magazines I read recently made a note about this.  If I recall the
price it was somewhere in the $50,000 range.  Also, I think someone here
on the list was actually scanned by such a device and has a Lightwave
Object of his head on ftp.

            Mike Comet

##

Subject:     Dr. Strange effects
Date:        Mon, 27 Apr 92 09:50 PDT
From:        Peter Daniels <[e-mail]>

Hi,
For any of you who are/have been comic book afficionados out there, I've been
trying to replicate some of the early Steve Ditko Dr. Strange drawings of other
dimensions, but I'm having a small problem.
   The effect that I'm after is that of a hole in space, something which has
depth when you look into it's mouth but is entirely transparent when viewed
from the side, except for the mouth.  For the tests, I've used a thick, hollow
tube with a ball in the center for depth effects.  The top of the tube, the
mouth, is colored as is the inside walls & bottom of the hole, and the faces
on the outside of the tube are set to 255/255/255 refelectivity.  I've
rendered it both with 255/255/255 and 0/0/0 filtering, and with color set to
both black & white, and the index of refraction set to 1.  In all cases, I get
sort of a lightly textured surface on the outside of the tube almost as though
roughness has been set (it hasn't).  Any ideas on what I may be doing wrong,
what I'm setting incorrectly?  It's a pretty nifty effect otherwise - if I
squint I can make it work!
  Thanks for the help. This is working with 2.0, by the way.

Peter D.
PS - Anyone know what kind of speed increase I can expect going from a 25 to a
50 mhz FPU on a 3000?  Surely not 2x, right?

##

Subject:     Re: New demo morph available for ftp
Date:        Mon, 27 Apr 92 17:15:47 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

This message was intended to go to the list but was bounced and only I
received it (I think).

------- Forwarded Message
From: Daniel P. Vunck <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 92 10:46:43 EDT
In-Reply-To:  <[e-mail]>; from "Mark Thompso
n" at Apr 24, 92 2:01 pm

>Well with all the hoopla about morphing with Imagemaster, I had to
>try it out. So I put together a test morph to see how well the
>software would work. The results are on hubcap.clemson.edu and the

Did anyone else see the software being shown by the people at the GVP
booth?  It was called MIRAGE and as well as having a lot of image
processing power, 24bit painting, and a great interface, it also did
morphs much smoother than anything I've seen done before!
------- End of Forwarded Message

My reply....
Sure did. Not too shabby.
None of the morphs I saw done with Mirage impressed me as much as the one
I did with Imagemaster. What do you mean by smoother? What I noticed about
the Mirage morph demo was it looked like the control points were not chosen
as well as they could have been. Also, these morphs were done in black
and white which tends to hide some of the possible color problems that can
arise during a morph.
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Re: New demo morph available for ftp
Date:        Mon, 27 Apr 92 17:25:48 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

------- Forwarded Message
From: Daniel P. Vunck <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 92 16:43:23 EDT
In-Reply-To:  <[e-mail]>; from "Mark Thompso
n" at Apr 27, 92 4:24 pm

my mailer keeps bouncing everything I send to the list. Feel
free to forward the original and your reply if you can.

>None of the morphs I saw done with Mirage impressed me as much as
>the one I did with Imagemaster. What do you mean by smoother? What
>I noticed about the Mirage morph demo was it looked like the control
> points were not chosen as well as they could have been. Also, these
> morphs were done in black and white which tends to hide some of the
> possible color problems that can arise during a morph.

I allowed a bit for the morphs not being done with a DCTV display -
HAM fringing was evident.  As for smooth and the color question, only
one morph was done in black and white.  I saw several others done in
full color and aside from the HAM fringes, they looked much better
than anything I've seen available...I'll download and look at yours
right away though!  I was very impressed by two morphs they did by
only moving a few points...I've never been able to get a reasonable
looking morph in ImageMaster without using around 50 points or more.

The real test will be we we can all try it ourselves tho!

------- End of Forwarded Message

They must have had several demos and we saw different ones. Unfortunately
none of the ones I saw were in color. As for number of points, the demos
I did see looked about like the first test sequence I did with Imagemaster
using only 9 points. However, to get something I was really pleased with
required around 60. But ofcourse Mirage isn't even ready yet and as you
say, you won't really know until we try it ourselves. Note that ADPro
is also working toward a morphing solution.
%~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~%
%      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  %
% --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   %
%      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   %
%     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   %
%                                                                          %
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Re: MarkMorph
Date:        Mon, 27 Apr 92 17:56:25 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

Colin Stuckless writes:
> I have your demo morph done with ImageMaster and needless
> to say, it's very impressive. I would like to know how long it took you
> to get those results.
>    Maybe you could post a reply to the mailing list, if you think there's
> enough interest.

It took about 1.5 hours to scan, scale, remove backgound, and place the
images in similar positions so the morph would not translate across the
screen. A good part of this time was wasted because I had to switch so much
between programs (Toaster Paint, ADPro, and Imagemaster). I then spent
another 15 - 30 minutes placing roughly 60 control points.  Another 50 or so
points were used to tack down the image edges.  I tested the seqence at
96x60 and then did the final render of 40 frames at 400 x 400 with IFF24
output. This took about 10-12 hours on a 25MHz 030.  These were then
composited onto a 752 x 480 blue background for single framing out the
Toaster. The same frames were also batch converted to DCTV format for
uploading to the ftp site. I did do a little bit of touching up of the
frames in DCTV, but I have a feeling it could have been avoided if I was
more aware of the process involved up front.
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Re: what is cyberscanning ?
Date:        Mon, 27 Apr 92 18:03:05 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

> >Does anyone know anything about "cyberscanning" ?

>     I forget what company makes the device, I beleive one of the
> amiga magazines I read recently made a note about this.  I think someone
> here on the list was actually scanned by such a device and has a Lightwave
> Object of his head on ftp.

That would be me. I was scanned last year at Siggraph by a Cyberware
3D digitizer. Cyberware is located in beautiful Monterey, CA and can be
reached at:
Cyberware
8 Harris Court
Monterey, CA 93940
[phone]
The devices are very expensive but do a great job. Cyberware will also
perform scanning services (ie. you don't have to buy the scanner).
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Lightning?
Date:        Mon, 27 Apr 92 18:31:55 PDT
From:        "Daryl T. Bartley" <[e-mail]>

Just a quick question again, I am trying to get a good lightning-style effect.
I guess it would be better described as plain electricity. I am trying to get
electric sparks that crawl over a metal logo. I have been working with various
and sundry tubes extruded on irregular paths, morphing between the two. I have
also been playing with the fog and bright attribs for the sparks.

Any help on getting a convincing 'crawly spark' effect shall be greatly
appreciated.

(side note: the 'morphing between the two' up there is wrong. I have been using
a veritable truckload of objects for the 'keys' of the spark motions)

Daryl Bartley
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Understanding Imagine 2.0
Date:        Tue, 28 Apr 92 13:32:58 METDST
From:        Marco Pugliese <[e-mail]>

I've just received Understanding Imagine 230 by Steve Worley:
IT'S REALLY GREAT !!!
Thankyou Steve.

Ciao.
Marco
--
 *****************************************************************************
 * It is good to disregard analysis and design phases and to rush into the   *
 * software implementation, in order to gain the time needed to debug the    *
 * failures due to disregarding analysis and design phases.                  *
 *****************************************************************************
===============================================================================
  Marco Pugliese   *| Dipartimento di Scienze |* [e-mail]
  via Roncaglia 13 *|    dell'Informazione    |* [e-mail]
  20146 MILANO     *|        ---------        |* [e-mail]
  ITALY            *|  Universita' di MILANO  |* [e-mail]
===============================================================================

##

Subject:     1.2MB lzh too big
Date:        Tue, 28 Apr 92 13:36:47 EDT
From:        John Rosner <[e-mail]>

I would like to get Mark's morph for DCTV, but I use cross-dos to my
Amiga from my Sun and I only have 700k diskettes at home.  Is there a
Unix utility (SunOs) to break up an lzh file?

Thanks in advance,
John Rosner

##

Subject:     Re: 1.2MB lzh too big
Date:        Tue, 28 Apr 92 14:39:31 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

> Is there a Unix utility (SunOs) to break up an lzh file?

     NAME
          split - split a file into pieces

     SYNOPSIS
          split [ -n ] [ file [ name ] ]

     DESCRIPTION
          split reads file and writes it in n-line pieces (default
          1000 lines) onto a set of output files.  The name of the
          first output file is name with aa appended, and so on
          lexicographically, up to zz (a maximum of 676 files).  Name
          cannot be longer than 12 characters.  If no output name is
          given, x is default.

          If no input file is given, or if - is given in its stead,
          then the standard input file is used.

Use cat to put them back together (or join in AmigaDOS).
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Re: 1.2MB lzh too big
Date:        Tue, 28 Apr 92 16:59:29 -0400
From:        Udo K Schuermann <[e-mail]>

[e-mail] (John Rosner) writes:
> I would like to get Mark's morph for DCTV, but I use cross-dos to my
> Amiga from my Sun and I only have 700k diskettes at home.  Is there a
> Unix utility (SunOs) to break up an lzh file?

Mark Thompson <[e-mail]> writes:
>      SYNOPSIS
>           split [ -n ] [ file [ name ] ]
>
>      DESCRIPTION
>           split reads file and writes it in n-line pieces (default
>           1000 lines) onto a set of output files.  The name of the

The standard split works with text files only.  I've written a variant
which can handle binary files, too:

       SYNOPSIS
            split [ -n | -bn ] [ file [ name ] ]

       EXAMPLES
            split -1000    hugefile.txt hugefile.    ; std. split, 1000 lines
            split -b730112 hugefile.lzh hugefile.    ; fill 720K-disk exactly

If anyone wants it, I could make uuencoded AmigaBinary & C-Source available.

 ._.  Udo Schuermann       "qaStaHvlS wa' ram IoS SaD Hugh SlijlaH qetbogh IoD"
 ( )  [e-mail]                                     -- Klingon Proverb
 Seeking virtual memory

##

Subject:     Fusion Forty
Date:        Tue, 28 Apr 92 22:42:47 -0400
From:        Danny Griffin <[e-mail]>

When announcing the RCS Fusion Forty offer at our user's group meeting
this month, a member commented that he had called Impulse about '040
cards, and they told him that the only card that had given them (Imagine)
problems was the RCS Fusion Forty.  Apparently they didn't give any
specifics, therefore I am more than a little suspicious of their comments.
I've not noticed anyone here complaining about the Fusion Forty and Imagine.

Dan Griffin
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     New Textures for 3.0?
Date:        Wed, 29 Apr 92 20:10:29 PDT
From:        "Daryl T. Bartley" <[e-mail]>

Just wondering, were they planning on doing any real exotic textures for 3.0?
Like scales, or fur, or linoleum, or stucco, etc...

I knoew some of them could be done with brushes, but it just seems it would be
easier to have a texture for stuff like that. Also adds nice randomness to it.

BTW, did anyone get my previous post? Not to sound paranoid or anything, but
I got like a truckload of error messages (ie more than usual), and with the
current bizarre nature of the list, I was simply curious.

Daryl Bartley
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Animations with complex interaction of characters
Date:        Thu, 30 Apr 92 12:28:43 -0400
From:        [e-mail]

I am using Cycleman by Tim Wilson.  I do not know if people know about
this piece of software, but I think I paid $35 for it (well worth it
for me).  It is a fully-articulated human figure created as an Imagine
object.  You just load it into the Cycle Editor and you can create an
animation of a moving figure.  The arms, legs, head, torso, and neck
all move at several joints (all the ones you need for complex human
movment).  In addition, all the segments on the fingers move at the
joints (no moving toes though, the toes move as a group).  The
eyeballs move and so do the lips (you can make him talk).  The jaw
also moves.  Tim has included a walking, jogging, and one other cycle
that is ready to go.  Or you can use the figure object and create your
own cycles.  I have been working with the object itself and creating
the frames.  He also provides some good tips on how to use the Cycle
and Stage Editors. Tim has done a great job.  My only complaint has
nothing do with Cycleman.  It has spawned some questions about
animation with Imagine..

It was very difficult to find the control points.  A walking cycle is
relatively easy, but when more complex movement is required (two
wrestlers for example), the points seem to get lost.  You have to zoom
in and zoom out alot.  It was often near impossible to figure out how
to PIVOT or TWIST an appendage (or group of appendages).  I wonder if
there is not some method that others are using to deal with this.  It
just may be that most people do not try to animate objects as complex
as the one Tim has created.  Up until now, most of my time has been
spent in the stage editor.  I was originally wowed when I created the
tube-man from the tutorial in the manual. But there were very few
control points.

The other problem, and this may be a real stupid one, is that I could
not figure out how to incorporate the second wrestler into the
animation.  You can only work on one object in the cycle editor at a
time (or can you?).  I tried making a copy of the figure in the Detail
Editor, grouping it facing the other figure, and loading the "twins"
into the Cycle Editor.  But trying to figure out what was who and who
was what became a nightmare.  How does one integrate different objects
with complex movement into an animation?  (As I said before, I may be
missing something very simple--I hope).  I have been hearing alot
about Caligari 2 lately.  It has, I been told from several persons who
have given up Imagine entirely for C2, a wonderful user interface that
makes creating objects very simple and very quick.  You model and
stage things in real time.  No switching between a miriad of editors.
They all admit that Caligari 2 is missing alot of features that
Imagine offers.  But their answer is that it is so much easier to use,
that they do not miss the features.  They can produce finished works
in much less time.  Sometimes less is more.

Rich Nollman

##

Subject:     iff light sources
Date:        Thu, 30 Apr 92 13:41:35 GMT-0500
From:        Scott Matthew Krehbiel <[e-mail]>

Has anyone played around with IFF brushes as light sources??

Does it work like a slide projector, or does it put the entire
image on all affected objects?

Also, how do you control the projection size and ratio, if it
is like a slide projector ( where an object can be in only a
small part of the image )

I ask because I'm trying to get a fragmenting effect, like an image
being projected on half-open venitian blinds.  Does this look
feasible??

Thanks
Scott Krehbiel
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Imagine ANIMS AND RENDERINGS
Date:        Thu, 30 Apr 92 20:18:25 GMT
From:        Yury German <[e-mail]>

     Hello all of you Imagine Users out there.
I am here to ask you for your submision of IMAGINE (only Imagine)
Animations for inclusion on a Video Tape that will have a wide
distribution throughout the world.

     The Animation can be on any subject and for the initial copy must
be rendered in 1/4 screen HAM for fast playback rate!
The animation can be on any Subject exept SEXual related.

     Only the best anims will be selected.... The rules are... it has
to be an IMAGINE Only rendered anim with original objects. I am sorry
but part of the creative process must be the object itself.

     If you are choosen what will you get!! You will get the
satisfaction of having your anim on a videotape that will be spread
throughout the world. You will have prime billing for the anim which
will include your name and telephone number or address in case someone
wants to contact you for more work. You will also receive a free copy
of the video tape. Another thing you will have is your animation
recorded through a high end graphics board onto a Profesional Master
stock and sent to you! This will be one of the 3 formats (undecided as
to which one yet) Betacam-SP, 1" or 3/4 SP. S-VHS or VHS copies can be
done as well. In other words if you work with us we will work with you
:-)

     How to submit your anim.!!!
     Create it in one -Qarter screen ham. Archive it with LHA or LZ in
LHA format! Then you have few options which you can ask more about.

     To Contact Me Please leave a message--
     Through Here : Jimmy German
     GEnie        : Blue-Knight
     USENET/INTERNET/BITNET : imagine@bknight

     Or call by phone!
     [phone]
     [phone]

    _____________________________________________________________________
   |                                                                     |
   | Yury German                  yury@bknight or [e-mail]   |
   | Blue-Knight Productions      GENIE EMAIL: Blue-Knight               |
   | [phone]                (Graphic Design and Video Productions) |
   | [phone]          P.O. Box 985, Queens, New York, 11354  |
   |_____________________________________________________________________|

##

Subject:     1.2 MB too big, thanks
Date:        Fri, 1 May 92 07:04:41 EDT
From:        "John J. Rosner" <[e-mail]>

Thanks for all your replies,

Split works great, it turns out on SunOs 4.1 (on an IPC) split handles binary.
I actually used "split -2000 name" and it made 600KB files.
So I saw Mark's wife turn into a leopard and it is stunningly well done.

Later, John Rosner

##

Subject:     RCS Fusion 40
Date:        Fri, 1 May 92 15:29:57 -0400
From:        Brian Bishop <[e-mail]>

  Take it with a grain of salt, but....The local (Amiga) computer store dudes
claim that the Fusion 40 uses such slow memory that the wait states severly
(and severEly) water down the advantages of the 040. In fact, they claim that
the 50Mhz 030 is faster, which shouldn't be.

 Again, I regard this as possibly valid info, possibly just misinformation.


  Brian

##

Subject:     help - raytrace is broken!
Date:        Fri, 1 May 92 19:01:58 EDT
From:        "Steve J. Lombardi" <[e-mail]>

I'm having a very strange imagine problem. It has crept up twice
yet I can't find a common thread. I'll set up a scene, scanline render it
for proofing then try to do a full trace. I get the normal
initializing message then the percent rendered counter races from
0 to 100 in about 8 seconds. of course I have only a black
screen for my efforts. I never had this problem with V1.1. It
has only begun after 2.0 arrived. Is my skull simply numb?
Am I missing the obvious or has (gasp!) my ray tracer broken!?

I have tried to set a global size bar to 0,0,0 with no luck. also
I have a 9 meg machine so I don't think memory is an issue. During
object loading and initialization my memory counter bottems out
at about 4 megs. that seems adequate. Has anyone else noticed this?
Thanks for any input. One last thought just occurred to me. both scenes
that would scanline but not trace featured a good number of iff maps.
perhaps 10-15. Is there a limit. I know. I'm probably just making desperate
stabs in the dark.
--
Steve Lombardi
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re: help - raytrace is broken!
Date:        Fri, 1 May 92 20:10:24 CST
From:        James Hastings-Trew <telepro![e-mail]>

In a message dated Fri  1 Jun 92 17:56, Steve J. Lombardi <[e-mail].
wrote:

 SJL> I have tried to set a global size bar to 0,0,0 with no luck. also
 SJL> I have a 9 meg machine so I don't think memory is an issue. During
 SJL> object loading and initialization my memory counter bottems out
 SJL> at about 4 megs. that seems adequate. Has anyone else noticed this?

I have not noticed the problem you specifically have, but I do have a
possible cure. One of the configurations settings in Imagine is the amount
of free-ram available after the octree division of the space. This
configuration setting is (unfortunately) not a permanent setting but must
be made each time you start Imagine up. I find that with a scene that has a
LOT of brushmaps in it that I have to leave more RAM for that, and less for
the tracer. So I bump up the OTFL value so that more RAM is left for the
brushmaps. You might want to also mess with the OTRL value (max RAM to use
for octree) as well.

By allowing less ram for the octree division your trace will take longer,
but on the other hand, longer is better than not at all...

-- Via DLG Pro v0.992

##

Subject:     Problems with F/X Grow
Date:        Sat, 2 May 92 17:54:21 +0200
From:        Hannes Heckner <[e-mail]>

Hi Imagineers,

I tried to build a simple scene with a grow special effect using Imagine V2.0
but everytime i enter the stage editor i get a guru. What is wrong ?

Help needed immediatliy

Hannes

PS: I posted this before but i got a lot of errors and obviously nobody receive
d my message.

##

Subject:     Re: RCS Fusion 40
Date:        Sat, 2 May 92 18:49:24 EDT
From:        MICHAEL GARLAND <[e-mail]>

Brian Bishop says...
>
>   Take it with a grain of salt, but....The local (Amiga) computer store dudes
> claim that the Fusion 40 uses such slow memory that the wait states severly
> (and severEly) water down the advantages of the 040. In fact, they claim that
> the 50Mhz 030 is faster, which shouldn't be.
   Make that quite a few grains.  The '040 cache hit rate is extremly high.
This means that it hardly every has to access the memory which is
comparatibly slow.  When it does have to access the memory there will
be quite a few waits, probably more than an '030.  I don't think the dealer
understands how often that actully happends.  It you add 30 nanosecond
memory to the memory for no wait states, you would hardly notice any
speedup (maybe 3% or so).
   I would want slower memory on an '040 board if any at all.  All that
blatantly fast memory just costs a bunch more.  Just had to yell at this,
since the "dudes" at the store don't quite see the whole picture. A
stripped '040 (no mmu, no fpu) at 25Mhz is really close to a '030 at 50Mhz.

>  Again, I regard this as possibly valid info, possibly just misinformation.
--=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
programming: n. 1. The art of debugging a blank sheet of paper (or,
   in these days of on-line editing, the art of debugging an empty
   file).  2. n. A pastime similar to banging one's head against a
   wall, but with fewer opportunities for reward.  3. n. The most fun
   you can have with your clothes on (although clothes are not
   mandatory).
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
          Michael S. Garland, Jr.  (Houghton, MI)
         CS_major @ MTU  [phone]  "[e-mail]"

##

Subject:     2.0 chip mem
Date:        Sat, 2 May 92 19:03:48 GMT-0500
From:        Scott Matthew Krehbiel <[e-mail]>

Hi all,
Does 2.0 Imagine require a meg of Chip??  I only have 512K of chip,
and I'm wondering if I'll have to upgrade my hardware as well as
my software.  Thanks
Scott
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re: Problems with F/X Grow
Date:        Sat, 2 May 92 21:39:08 -0400
From:        "Michael B. Comet" <[e-mail]>

>Hi Imagineers,
>
>I tried to build a simple scene with a grow special effect using Imagine V2.0
>but everytime i enter the stage editor i get a guru. What is wrong ?
>
>Help needed immediatliy
>
>Hannes
>
>PS: I posted this before but i got a lot of errors and obviously nobody receiv
ed my message.
>
>

    Make sure you have a path grouped to the object you wish to
"GROW" and that you group the path as the PARENT of the group.

    If you are doing this, and your path is a valid path, then there
is no reason to be getting gurus.

Hope this helps

               Michael Comet
               [e-mail]

##

Subject:     TTDDD library
Date:        Sun, 3 May 92 12:05:40 EDT
From:        "Steve J. Lombardi" <[e-mail]>

help! where can the IXEMUPD-920330.lha file be found. I have
heard that it is on ab20.larc.nasa.gov but for whatever reason
I can never get in there. Is it anywhere on hubcap?? since that is
where I got the TTDDD files from, that would seem like a good place
for this library file as well. any help would be appreciated
as I  am eager to try these TTDDD programs out. thanks a bunch.

steve Lombardi
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     AB20
Date:        Sun, 3 May 92 12:53:12 -0700
From:        [e-mail]

 This is in response to the TTDDD post by Steve Lombardi, in case anyone else
doesn't know. AB20 is deceased. You can find a mirror of it's final state on
wuarchive.wustl.edu (128.252.135.4) in the mirrors/ab20.larc.nasa.gov directory
.

  ___________________________________________________________________________
 /  [e-mail]                                       |     //         \
|Oh, you're just gettin weird...and that results in creativ-|    //Only Amiga |
|ity" -Joel MST3K|Virtual Reality is the future of safe sex.|\\ //  makes it  |
 \__________________________________________________________|_\X/___possible_/

##

Subject:     TDDD -> DXF Translator available?
Date:        Sun, 3 May 92 16:50:37 -0400
From:        "Frederick E. Brown" <[e-mail]>

Anyone know if a TDDD -> DXF translator and/or code is available?

Thanx,

[e-mail]

##

Subject:     RIPPLE f/x
Date:        Mon, 04 May 92 10:24:47 -0400
From:        [e-mail]

Anyone had success using the RIPPLE f/x?  I want to create a pool of
water with a sphere that drops into it with the resulting circular
waves moving out from the sphere.  Is this possible with RIPPLE?  Or
is it not that fine-tuneable?  I can make a disturbed surface or a
surface that simulates the effects of splashes from of water from a
repeating drip.  But that is not the effect I am looking for.  I want
the smooth movement of concentric circles -- little waves -- moving out
from the sides of the sphere after it drops into the water and
disappears below the surface.

Rich Nollman

##

Subject:     Re: RIPPLE f/x
Date:        Mon, 4 May 92 11:18:13 -0400
From:        "Michael B. Comet" <[e-mail]>

>Anyone had success using the RIPPLE f/x?  I want to create a pool of
>water with a sphere that drops into it with the resulting circular
>waves moving out from the sphere.  Is this possible with RIPPLE?  Or
>is it not that fine-tuneable?  I can make a disturbed surface or a
>surface that simulates the effects of splashes from of water from a
>repeating drip.  But that is not the effect I am looking for.  I want
>the smooth movement of concentric circles -- little waves -- moving out
>from the sides of the sphere after it drops into the water and
>disappears below the surface.
>
>Rich Nollman
>
>
>

    Yep, This is what this effect is for.  (Actually there are two
ways to use the effect, one gives the concentric circles you were
talking about, and the other causes the object to wave like a flag).

    Anyways, try this:

        Add a primitive plane with dimensions 100x100 and maybe
20 or so sections for both directions.  (Fairly detailed).  Save the
object.  Then go into the stage or action editor and load up your object
for say a 30 frame animation.  Add the effect bar in the ACTION editor.
I think the defaults are fine.   If you want more ripples, change the
ripple count.  If you want the ripples higher, change the height value,
and if you want the ripples farther apart, change the wavelength value.

    You can also try the linear ripple.  This one starts at the
axis, (like the spherical ripple), but moves out linearly in a straight
path along the objects Y axis.

    You can do some really neat things.  I just made a small HAM
anim of this grenade I made.  Getting bored with just exploding it, I
gave it this ripple.  Looks normal, and then all of the sudden it
ripples like it as rubber or water.  Very weird, but cool looking!

    hope this helps.

    mike c.
    [e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re: What kind of BOZO would ask about extrude to path AGAIN!?
Date:        Mon, 04 May 92 14:23:37 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

Thanks to everyone for the help. This weekend, I actually had some time
to try it out. I tried several different approaches but nothing worked
as I wanted it to without Huge amounts of manual work. The technique
that came the closest was to load an IFF bitmap of my logo into Imagine
and then have it auto-trace it without filling in the interior polygons.
I then named this object PATH. Finally, I took two concentric disks and
used Mold/Extrude and specified PATH as the extrusion path. Works like a
champ except for one BIG problem. The object being extruded along the
path does not rotate with the path tangent as it travels along it. As far
as I'm concerned, any path extrusion is totally useless if the object
does not rotate with the path. Why would Impulse even bother with such a
tool if they weren't going to rotate the object? Am I missing something?

Another sugestion was to use Replicate instead of Extrude with spheres.
However, this will not only look bad and waste polygons, but it also will
not accomplish what is needed: letters formed from two concentric tubes
(the outer tube will be a translucent glow).

So I guess what I'm asking is, did anyone succeed in making this work
without lots and lots and lots of tedious manual work, or shall I chalk
this up as an undoable task for Imagine?
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Re: RIPPLE f/x
Date:        Mon, 4 May 92 11:50:32 -0700
From:        66291000 <[e-mail]>

Here's another suggestion for the Ripple F/X:

    If you want really symmetrical concentric circles, Add a Primitive
Disk and then Divide it five or six times (more if you're gonna get very
close to the object in your animation.  Make sure that the edges of the
disk are covered somehow (by land, edges of the screen, etc).  Then go
ahead and add the Ripple F/X and you'll have a great looking animation.

    Another nice trick is to make the object metal (chrome and gold
work particularly well).  Pseudo-T2 effects!

    Best of luck,
        Stefon

##

Subject:     Converting from Imagine to DCTV format
Date:        Tue, 05 May 92 11:47:29 -0400
From:        [e-mail]

Thanks to everyone who helped me to get RIPPLE to work.  I got it to
work last night (I was doing alot of stupid things, and the Impulse
documentation did not help).  Even the Stage Editor animation blew me
away.  It did EXACTLY what I thought it would do.

Now, I need to know how to convert my Imagine anims (or pics) to DCTV
format.  I tried to figure out how to use ADAM, but there are some
very basic points that I must be missing.  There is documentation and a
great user interface, (all that is required is someone with some basic
intelligence to use it...) but the documentation must be leaving
something out.

Basically, I want to run my Imagine-created RIPPLE anim through DCTV.
How do I do it?  I have Showanim, Show, the DCTVtoILBM24 conversion
utility, and Makeanim in the directory with ADAM as indicated by the
documentation.  I tried to get it to work, but the thing just sits
there and says: waiting...frame 1.

1. I need to know how to convert an existing Imagine anim file, and

2. how to automatically (I think that is the purpose of ADAM) convert
my Imagine anims to DCTV as the frames are being rendered by Imagine
(that is, I assume, what ADAM is "waiting" for).

3. I also tried using the convert module in DCTV and was confused
about which way the tool converts.  Is it from DCTV format to standard
Amiga formats, Amiga formats to DCTV, or both?  Where does ADAM fit
in?

I assume once I understand how to convert my Imagine files to DCTV
format, all the other conversions (Deluxpaint,etc.) will be simple.

Thanks.

     __      __
    /_/\    / /\
   _\ \ \  / /  \  __
  /_/\_\ \/_/ /\ \/_/\  __
  \ \  _  \ \ \_\ \ \ \/ /\
   \ \ \_\/\ \ \/ /\ \ \/ /   +------------------------------------+
    \ \ \   \ \  /  \ \  /    | Rich Nollman                       |
     \_\/    \_\/    \_\/     | [e-mail]                   |
     /_/\    /_/\    / /\     | [phone]                     |
    _\_\ \__ \ \ \  / / /     +------------------------------------+
   /_/\/\/_/\_\_\ \/_/ /
   \ \ \/\ \ \|  _/\ \ \
    \ \ \/\ \ \ |   \ \ \
     \ \  /\ \  |    \ \ \
      \_\/  \_\/      \_\/

##

Subject:     Re: What kind of BOZO would ask about extrude to path AGAIN!?
Date:        Tue, 05 May 92 11:58:28 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

Thanks Udo, David, and Chris for pointing to me the 'Align Y to path'
gadget which was so painfully obvious in the requestor that I am horrendously
embarrassed that I even asked for help. Thanks again, I am now happily
extruding glowing neon tubes.
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     RCS fusion 40 questions
Date:        Tue, 5 May 92 11:48:25 CDT
From:        Toaster Man <[e-mail]>

I will probably be buying a RCS 040 soon.. but i have been hearing stuff about
it i dont necessarly like.. For instance someone posted a while ago that
it doesnt work with imagine?  Does it work with the toaster?  Also I have
been hearing that its about as fast as a 50mhz 030??  does anyone have the
specs on this baby?  mimps,ram, etc?

steve t.

##

Subject:     Re: Converting from Imagine to DCTV format
Date:        Tue, 5 May 92 10:17:51 PDT
From:        "John T. Grieggs" <[e-mail]>

> 1. I need to know how to convert an existing Imagine anim file, and
>
You can't.  It's an evolutionary dead end, compatible with nothing else
in the world.  What you want to do is render 24-bit frames, and convert
THEM to DCTV.

> 2. how to automatically (I think that is the purpose of ADAM) convert
> my Imagine anims to DCTV as the frames are being rendered by Imagine
> (that is, I assume, what ADAM is "waiting" for).
>
ADAM will convert the frames to DCTV format as they are rendered, and build
an ANIM from them when they have all been rendered and converted.  It has
options for the rez to convert to and the number and location of frames to
wait for, among other things.

> 3. I also tried using the convert module in DCTV and was confused
> about which way the tool converts.  Is it from DCTV format to standard
> Amiga formats, Amiga formats to DCTV, or both?  Where does ADAM fit
> in?
>
It does both.  ADAM is the equivalent of running the standalone program,
IFFTODCTV, repeatedly, interspersed with appropriate file manipulation,
followed by MAKEANIM.

> I assume once I understand how to convert my Imagine files to DCTV
> format, all the other conversions (Deluxpaint,etc.) will be simple.
>
All conversions are simple once you know what you are doing!  :-)  A key
point is to keep the 24-bit versions of your pics lying around, so that
you can always create a new version of the highest possible quality.  And
invest in Art Department Professional, you won't regret it!

(Obnoxiously long .signature deleted)

##

Subject:     Re: What kind of BOZO would ask about extrude to path AGAIN!?
Date:        Wed, 6 May 92 0:49:40 CDT
From:        "Scott Jones (Dr. Jones)" <[e-mail]>

I know I am really the bozo now!  I didnt bother to follow the thread
on this subject and was curious as to how you get the neon tubes to
glow?  I am doing a project at work that could move me from part
time sales to full time video productions, and this would be a
thing I would need to do with the project I have in mind...

I guess I would be more interested in doing this in Lightwave than
Imagine, but I am still very interested in how to do it in Imagine.

Thanks...
Scott..

##

Subject:     Re: RCS fusion 40 questions
Date:        Wed, 6 May 1992 07:21:11 GMT
From:        Stephen Menzies <[e-mail]>

[e-mail] (Toaster Man) writes:

>I will probably be buying a RCS 040 soon.. but i have been hearing stuff about
>it i dont necessarly like.. For instance someone posted a while ago that
>it doesnt work with imagine?  Does it work with the toaster?  Also I have
>been hearing that its about as fast as a 50mhz 030??  does anyone have the
>specs on this baby?  mimps,ram, etc?

>steve t.
>R

Imagine: I too read that post and spoke to RCS about it. They told me that
while they had some calls regarding Imagine in the past there was nothing
that was really reproduceable. Since the last 4 months however (with the
release of new versions of the RCS install software), software related
calls have dropped to almost nil. Until they (and me too, because I've
never had a problem testing Imagine on the RCS board) hear differently
they can only assume Imagine and the board are perfectly compatable.

Lightwave: Again, any problems between toaster(see below), lw (I don't
think there ever was any), toaster paint (I believe there was a problem
somewhere), appear to have completely cleared up with more recent
upgrades of the RCS software and the use of the C='s newest version of
"setpatch". There was one outstanding problem (that I am aware of) with
regards to vertical scrolling of generics. I was demonstrated the
problem. Apparently, (as of a few days ago), this problem was solved.

Amiga: There was a problem with 6.2 rev motherboards and I posted to
this effect a few weeks ago. This problem was solved (requires a
change in a chip on the RCS board).

030/50mhz: Last summer I tested the board (under 1.3) against the 030/50.
At that time the 040 was about twice as fast. I also know that the
RCS board is again, atleast twice as fast now over what it was 4 months
ago (again with the new RCS software/setpatch. BTW, every F40 user
should be using the newest version of the RCS software, 2.021 which
includes the new setpatch.
But it would be nice to be more precise about this. I have an Imagine
file at RCS right now (an old file called , exploded_garden, which is
in the neigbourhood of 75,000 polys. I will render it with Im2.0, and
then sometime soon, take the file over to the universitie's lab and
run it on the GVP030/50 and see what results I can come up with. This
isn't something I can do tommorrow though, but when I find time I'll
do it and post the results. But off the cuff, I would have to say,
given tests that I have already done in the past, and working with
the 030/50 at the university, that the RCS040 is *significantly* faster
than the 030/50. Test results will be nice, but I can tell you now that
I wouldn't want to work Caligari-B on the 030/50 after working
with it on the 040.

Finally, it's worth mentioning that most(all) of the software that we
are presently using has not really been optimized for the 040 yet.
We will again see a significant increase when that happens. Also, the
040 seems to like polys, the more you throw at it, the faster it goes.

Anyway..see what I can do.

-stephen
--
Stephen Menzies
#Internet: [e-mail]
#Fidonet : Stephen Menzies @ 1:167/265

##

Subject:     Re: What kind of BOZO would ask about extrude to path AGAIN!?
Date:        Wed, 06 May 92 10:04:55 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

Scott Jones write:
> I know I am really the bozo now!  I didnt bother to follow the thread
> on this subject and was curious as to how you get the neon tubes to
> glow?

Actually, this was never discussed becauase I already knew how to do that.
I just needed the extrusion method.

> I guess I would be more interested in doing this in Lightwave than
> Imagine, but I am still very interested in how to do it in Imagine.

I am not exactly sure how you would accomplish the glow in Imagine (or even
if you can) but it was my intent to do all the rendering in LightWave. To
do this, make the outer tube luminous with transparent edges and about
40% transparency (I set the Edge Threshold to around .75 but that will
vary depending on the ratio of the tube diameters) and don't forget
smoothing. The inner tube is just a standard smooth luminous surface.
Then add a couple of point lights set to the color of the neon to make
the surrounding objects pick up a nice warm neon glow. Quite simple
actually and very nice looking.
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     black borders on DCTV images
Date:        Wed, 06 May 92 12:53:38 -0400
From:        [e-mail]

When I run an Imagine animation using Imagine's animation program, the
images fill the screen.  I converted the animation using ADAM and
MAKEANIM.  The screens were centered but with black borders (used the
default screen sizes).  Should I be using extreme overscan or
something to create frames that fill the screen and eliminate the
black borders or is that simple the way DCTV displays its anims?  Am I
doing something wrong?

Is there some reason that the black borders might desireable?  I
remember vaguely someone telling me that black borders are good for
submittals to professional studios because it allows the engineers to
be able to manipulate the images exactly when tranferring to a larger
format.

Thanks.

Rich Nollman

##

Subject:     Essence
Date:        Wed,  6 May 92 13:32:16 PDT
From:        [e-mail]

Look what I found in the Apex Vendors area on Portal.
Apex Software is proud to announce its new software product:

                           ESSENCE
                Algorithmic Textures for Imagine



The 3D software Imagine by Impulse, Inc. allows users to define object
attributes with an "algorithmic texture," a surface that can be
characterized with a mathematical algorithm as opposed to just
"painting on" an image with brushmap.  Examples of these algorithmic
textures are checkerboards, grids, camouflage, and even wood. THESE
TEXTURES ARE NOT BRUSHMAPS OR PICTURES. They are algorithms Imagine
uses to color your object. They take very little RAM (about 1-15K
each) and have no pixel artifacts.

Apex Software Publishing has developed Essence, additional
Imagine-compatible algorithmic textures for use with Imagine, which
gives users a library of even more surfaces for their objects. These
additional textures range from simple textures like Hex, a tiling of
colored hexagons, to a complex surface called Fractal Noise, which
makes a turbulent, detail-rich natural looking coloring for objects
like clouds, fire, planets, landscapes, or even dirt.

These textures were designed and written by award winning Amiga artist
Steven Worley with the help of Glenn Lewis, author of the powerful
Imagine TTDDD utility package. Steve is also the author of the
successful book "Understanding Imagine 2.0."

Essence should be released in late June of 1992. The library has over
40 (forty!) new textures to the 12 Impulse textures. The retail price
of Essence has not yet been set.

A description of some of the new textures:


Counter: A flat texture that applies the image of an LCD display to
an object's surface. The number it displays is defined in the
texture parameters.  By morphing the object in Imagine (which is
clearly described in the Essence manual) the LCD display can  form
a timer, speedometer, or any other numerical display you wish.

Floortile:A bit like Impulse's "Checks" in that squares are added to
your object. However, these squares have the classic utilitarian
floortile appearance with long, irregular streaks of material running
through the tile, and with tiles are oriented at right angles to
one another.

Fractal Noise: A suite of textures that are difficult to describe.
Fractal noise is a turbulent, detailed blend of colors that can be
used for naturally detailed surfaces ranging from clouds to dirt.
Lightwave 3D has a similar texture, although the Apex version is
considerably more versatile. The fractal noise can be animated in
time, allowing the surface image to swirl and eddy as the object is
animated.  There are versions of fractal noise that apply single or
multiple colors with sharp or soft boundaries. Reflectivity and
transparency can also be controlled though fractal noise.  Fractal
noise is a workhorse that is nearly indispensable for many realistic
surfaces. How else can you make an animated photorealistic, swirling
planet atmosphere in three minutes?

Granite: A relative of fractal noise, for a variety of rock surfaces
with complex detail.

Hex: A tiling of hexagons. Simple, but a very pleasant alternative to
checkerboards!

HueRotate: This changes the color of your object by "rotating" the
color shades of your object around the color wheel (blue to magenta to
red to yellow to green to cyan to blue). This can make wonderful
surface effects, especially when animated. This can also change the
color of images added with brushmaps.

Mandelbrot: An amazing twist on a classic image! The fractal
Mandelbrot set is computed on the fly. This image has an infinite
amount of detail, with beautiful spirals and structure. By zooming the
camera closer to the object surface, you can magnify the region you
are looking at. See the Mandelbrot set with a flight-simulator like
perspective! A truly stunning texture.

RGBvary: Related to fractal noise, this texture does not ADD color,
but it instead varies the color that already exists. Most real world
objects have slight color variations due to wear or weather. RGBvary
will take (for example) green paint and subtly change the shades of
the paint over the surface of your object. This variation adds
considerable realism to your object. The amount of variation, of
course, is completely user definable.

Swirl: A spiral based surface like a spinning hypnotist's disk or a
barber pole.

Transporter: Star Trek fans can now fade in and out objects in true
sci-fi style. Make an animation of your favorate transporter
malfunction!


Veined Marble: Finally! Layered veins of turbulent photo-realistic
marble.


-----------

These textures are FULLY compatible with the floating point versions
of Imagine 2.0, Imagine 1.1, and even Turbo Silver. You load and use
them in an identical fashion to the current Impulse-supplied textures.
Currently, there is no support for using the textures in the integer
versions of Imagine designed to run only on a 68000 processor, but if
demand is high enough this can be implemented in the future.

Essence should be available in late June through most Amiga dealers
and mail order firms. If you want to get more information or a flyer
(when we print one!) you can write to:

Essence Info
Apex Software Publishing
405 El Camino Real Suite 121
Menlo Park CA 94025 USA



------

Imagine is a trademark of Impulse Inc.
Essence is a trademark of Apex Software Publishing.
Lincoln is the capitol of Nebraska.

------

Steve has allowed me the honor of beta-testing these textures and all I can
say is they will knock your socks off!!!

Ben Gibson

##

Subject:     Re: Essence
Date:        Thu, 7 May 92 0:52:23 PDT
From:        Chihtsung Jeffrey Lin <[e-mail]>

Forwarded message:
> From [e-mail]  Wed May  6 14:01:19 1992
> To: [e-mail]
> From: [e-mail]
> Subject: Essence
> Lines: 137
> Date: Wed,  6 May 92 13:32:16 PDT
> Message-Id: <[e-mail]>
> X-Origin: The Portal System (TM)
>
> Look what I found in the Apex Vendors area on Portal.
> Apex Software is proud to announce its new software product:
>
>                            ESSENCE
>                 Algorithmic Textures for Imagine
>
   [ The description deleted ]
>
>
>
> Steve has allowed me the honor of beta-testing these textures and all I can
> say is they will knock your socks off!!!
>
> Ben Gibson
>

      Can you put some pictures generated  with these textures on hubcap?
      Thanks.


                             Jeff:)

##

Subject:     Re: Essence
Date:        Thu, 07 May 92 10:02:06 EDT
From:        Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

>                            ESSENCE
>                 Algorithmic Textures for Imagine

Well how bout that. Those textures look kind of familiar. Steve was asking
me some texture questions back in March and it looks like he put the
info to good use. Here is a snipit from the conversation:

                    ----------------------------------
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 92 18:21:02 EST
To: [e-mail]
From: Mark Thompson <[e-mail]>

> What kind of algorithmic surfaces are most lacking in
> all of the 3D programs, commercial and PD?

Various color rainbows for realistically modeling gemstones, laser discs,
and other diffraction effects.
Animated turbulent noise with a non-linear direction vector allowing the
patterns to swirl and twist (with and/or without control). Also allow
full spectrum color cycling.
Cloth textures. Image maps are great, but complex soft surfaces prevent
projective mapping from being viable. Procedurals or 2D texturing is needed.
Fuzz/hair. It ain't easy, but it sure would be nice. Doing it effectively
would require significant changes to the rendering engine however.
Anisotropic surfaces liked brushed aluminum.
Better procedural ripples/waves (but ofcourse you knew that).
Multi color graduations with different spread functions (could be a
subset of the rainbows above).

I'll think of some more but that should keep you busy :-)

                    ----------------------------------
The fuzz/hair would be great but current techniques use density functions
which would likely require changes in Imagine's rendering code. I have
some ideas to get around that but it would not be nearly as easy to
implement as the other procedurals I mentioned.
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
|      `       '        Mark Thompson                 CONCURRENT COMPUTER  |
| --==* RADIANT *==--   [e-mail]        Principal Graphics   |
|      ' Image `        ...!uunet!masscomp!mark       Hardware Architect   |
|     Productions       [phone] [phone]   & General Nuisance   |
|                                                                          |
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

##

Subject:     Global reflectance seem?
Date:        Thu,  7 May 92 15:16:04 PDT
From:        [e-mail]

Ok, heres the prob.  I created a image in VistaPro of clouds (Aimed the camera
at the sky).  Loaded it into DCTV, smoothed it out a bit.  Saved it as a IFF
24.  Used it as a BG and global reflectance image.  NOW  I had a sphere
refecting it.  And theres a black "seem" that is rather wide running around
about 300 degrees of it, you can see it on the top AND bottom!  It's not a
thin seem either, I rendered it in HI-res DCTV.  Looks cool except for the
seem.  I'm REALLY into Imagine now that I have a 3000. 10 megs/25 MHz!

##

Subject:     Re: Global reflectance seem?
Date:        Thu, 7 May 92 19:25:54 CDT
From:        Wayne Haufler 283-4160 <[e-mail]>

[e-mail] (whoever that really is) writes:
> Ok, heres the prob.  I created a image in VistaPro of clouds (Aimed the camer
a
> at the sky).  Loaded it into DCTV, smoothed it out a bit.  Saved it as a IFF
> 24.  Used it as a BG and global reflectance image.  NOW  I had a sphere
> refecting it.  And theres a black "seem" that is rather wide running around
> about 300 degrees of it, you can see it on the top AND bottom!  It's not a
> thin seem either, I rendered it in HI-res DCTV.  Looks cool except for the
> seem.  I'm REALLY into Imagine now that I have a 3000. 10 megs/25 MHz!

I remember having a answering a similar problem way back in November 91.
Here is that question and answer from Nov 6 91.

Subject: Re:  spherical brushmaps

[e-mail] (Dan Drake) writes:
> 2.) when My planet is rotating, at one point there is a white line that goes
> from the top of the planet to the bottom.  North to south pole.  The color
> of the sphere before I did the mapping is white.  Does this mean that the map
> did not go all of the way around the planet?  I guess I can solve this by
> changing to color of the planet to blue instead of white.
>
I had the same problem quite a while ago.  It turns out that I had forgotten
to paint underneath the horizontal menu bar and vertical toolbox bar in
DPAINT III.  It is easy to forget these regions.  A Fill with these bars
visible does not fill underneath them.  Imagine wraps the entire 640x400
image, including those possibly unpainted regions.

This may or may not be your problem.  That unpainted region on mine appeared
more like a 10 degree black wedge at the 'back' of the sphere.  BTW,
a rendered frame of the camera aimed at the north or south pole of that
sphere resulted in a pretty cool and strange 'tree ring'-like image.
Probably the results of severe distortions of the brush at those
regions.

Hope this helps :)


         __      Wayne A. Haufler   [Christian/SW Engineer/XWindows/Amigan]
\\ /\\ /\\ //_    [e-mail]    McDonnell Douglas-Houston
 \/--\// \//__    Hobby:"Exploring the Use of Computer Graphics and
     //                  Animations To Support Christian Endeavors"

##

Subject:     Re: Global reflectance seem?
Date:        Fri, 8 May 92 13:22:43 PDT
From:        "John T. Grieggs" <[e-mail]>

> Ok, heres the prob.  I created a image in VistaPro of clouds (Aimed the camer
a
> at the sky).  Loaded it into DCTV, smoothed it out a bit.  Saved it as a IFF
> 24.  Used it as a BG and global reflectance image.  NOW  I had a sphere
> refecting it.  And theres a black "seem" that is rather wide running around
> about 300 degrees of it, you can see it on the top AND bottom!  It's not a
> thin seem either, I rendered it in HI-res DCTV.  Looks cool except for the
> seem.  I'm REALLY into Imagine now that I have a 3000. 10 megs/25 MHz!
>
I had a problem a while back which may be related.  I created a brush map
in Light 24, intending to wrap it onto an object in Imagine.  It worked ok,
except for a large black area on one of the edges.  Yuck!  Eventually I
figured out that Light was padding the right edge of the brush out to some
arbitrary spot (probably a word boundary).  To fix it, I loaded the brush
into ADPro and used the Crop_Visual Operator to trim it.

_john

##

Subject:     See thru maps
Date:        Fri, 8 May 1992 21:22:03 -0600
From:        HURTT CHRISTOPHER MICHAEL <[e-mail]>

    Here's a question. Is it possible to make a brushmap where color0
allows the objects attributes to show thru? It seems now if you want to
slap a logo on a plane, you are forced into having to map a square onto the
plain, rather than just the logo. Ex: a slab with a circle mapped on
it would have a black box (or whatever color) around the circle.
    How can this be avoided? Buy using the full scale value perhaps? Or
do I need to make a copy of the object, map the circle on it, then map a
transparency map of the area around the circle to the copy, and put it
directly over the slab? Or (even worse) cut very carefully the brush out in
Dpain rather than using a box?

    If it can't be done easily (by some stupid error on my part or the
full scale value) then I'd like to suggest this as a future mapping
feature. Also, a "light" brushmap type would be great to, every where there
is color in the map, a light is applied in that color. Be trival to make
flashing displays, cities, and spaceships that glow correctly.

    Chris

##

Subject:     An Idea for Imagine.
Date:        Sat, 9 May 92 12:13:49 -0700
From:        Steve Galle <[e-mail]>

Does anyone know thae address for someone at Impulse? I had an idea that
would be really great for all of us stuck with limited chip ram. It came
to me as I was rendering, and hadn't enough chip to use more than 8 colors
in dpaint. I decided that it would be REALLY nice if Imaging would do it's
rndering out of a window on the workbench instead of a screen. All it would
even need is a cancel button and a progress monitor. I think this would be a
GREAT thing for Impulse to consider, and I can't see how it would be too
hard to accomplish. Anyone like the idea? Also, has ANYONE gotten trans-
parancy mapping to work with the integer version of 1.1? It seems to be
broken on all the 1.1's I've tried it on. (It works under the fp version..)
Just curious about what you all thought.
-Steve Galle
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re:  See thru maps
Date:        Sun, 10 May 92 08:25:46 est
From:        "-s90066729-k.wong-ele-60-" <[e-mail]>

    Michael,
        I have found that if you use the Genlock button when
    laying down a brush map the areas of black on your map will
    then become "see-thru".  I'm not sure if this actually does
    interfere when you do genlock (I don't have a genlock :-)
    but it's a great way of doing Decaling!

    Kev.

##

Subject:     bye for now
Date:        Sun, 10 May 92 20:24:11 PDT
From:        Kevin Kodama <[e-mail]>

well, for the last couple of weeks there has been alot of strange mail
site stuff, and no imagine stuff :(
so, i have an IMAGINE question !
Apex is apparently releasing a bunch of procedural textures soon,
i have read the press release, etc...and want to know if any of the
textures will be "bump" map type textures, or will they all be color
manipulation tools- i would love to see some fractal bumps as well as
fractal noise...also, are there any other cool type textures people
have seen on other (high end) systems that would be appropriate for
Imagine ?

Btw, i saw a very nice demo of Alias Sketch for the Macintosh-nurbs based
modeling, with a very sweet interface, and GRAPHICAL interface for assigning
color, specularity, texture, etc..

[e-mail]

##

Subject:     RE: Discount?
Date:        Mon, 11 May 92 08:18:36 MDT
From:        Paul Johnston <[e-mail]>

Impulse definitely has copies of Steve Worley's book for Imagine owners. Cost i
s
$20.00 + $ 5.00 shipping (after seeing the packaging you'll know why). They too
k
awhile to ship my copy because they had to backorder it (must be selling well).
I believe the $24.00 + ?? shipping was from Steve's company Apex Software to
readers of the Imagine mailing list (all of whom may not own Imagine and see
the offer from Impulse).

By the way, note where this post originates, hope it works.

##

Subject:     Re:  See thru maps
Date:        Mon, 11 May 92 08:24:12 MDT
From:        Paul Johnston <[e-mail]>

 I have not tried the Genlock button when laying down a brush map, but I  have
a
related issue.

 I am trying to create a wood plank that has the standard wood texture (no
problem), but the wood I am modeling is stained. The wood itself is dark, the
grain is a lighter color and the stain is reddish. I've tried applying a
linear texture to the object. The results are nice but covers over the wood
grain. Anyone have ideas as to how to approach this task with Imagine 2.0?

 I agree with Michael that a way to layer textures, or combine them via user
control would be very handy.

PAJ

##

Subject:     Re:  See thru maps
Date:        Mon, 11 May 92 08:24:12 MDT
From:        Paul Johnston <[e-mail]>

 I have not tried the Genlock button when laying down a brush map, but I  have
a
related issue.

 I am trying to create a wood plank that has the standard wood texture (no
problem), but the wood I am modeling is stained. The wood itself is dark, the
grain is a lighter color and the stain is reddish. I've tried applying a
linear texture to the object. The results are nice but covers over the wood
grain. Anyone have ideas as to how to approach this task with Imagine 2.0?

 I agree with Michael that a way to layer textures, or combine them via user
control would be very handy.

PAJ

##

Subject:     Re: Getting the list back to subject
Date:        Mon, 11 May 92 08:31:51 MDT
From:        Paul Johnston <[e-mail]>

Kevin makes a nice point in Subject: bye for now.

I also have looked at some of the Mac based 3d products.  Rendering time seems
much slower but I like some of the features in various products. One, I forget
which, has a pallete of textures that you can pick from. This allows you to
see what you'll get before you render. I have SurfaceMaster and MapMaster by
Markoya and these products are similar, but something built into Imagine would
be wonderful.

What other new features should we ask for?

PAJ

##

Subject:     Re:  See thru maps
Date:        Mon, 11 May 92 12:46:09 EDT
From:        Dan Drake <[e-mail]>

>  I am trying to create a wood plank that has the standard wood texture (no
> problem), but the wood I am modeling is stained. The wood itself is dark, the
> grain is a lighter color and the stain is reddish. I've tried applying a
> linear texture to the object. The results are nice but covers over the wood
> grain. Anyone have ideas as to how to approach this task with Imagine 2.0?
>

Why don't you approximate teh colors of the stained wood and grain when you
define the wood colors in the texture.  Then you can twiddle with the
shininess or dullness in the attributes requester.

I find that I have to change the way I think, from asking myself how things
are created, to how the person looking at it views it.

dan.

##

Subject:     Re:  See thru maps
Date:        Mon, 11 May 92 14:11:07 -0400
From:        "Michael B. Comet" <[e-mail]>

> I have not tried the Genlock button when laying down a brush map, but I  have
 a
>related issue.
>
> I am trying to create a wood plank that has the standard wood texture (no
>problem), but the wood I am modeling is stained. The wood itself is dark, the
>grain is a lighter color and the stain is reddish. I've tried applying a
>linear texture to the object. The results are nice but covers over the wood
>grain. Anyone have ideas as to how to approach this task with Imagine 2.0?
>
> I agree with Michael that a way to layer textures, or combine them via user
>control would be very handy.
>
>PAJ
>
>

    Okay, cool.  I just tried the Genlock Brush feature and it works
this way:  The part of the brush map that is color 0, becomes clear so
that at that point, the OBJECT color is what is shown.

    This was a feature I asked for before 2.0 was implemented.
After seeing Todd Rundgren's Toaster video, I told Impulse I wanted a
way to a pply a brushmap on color 0, so like Lightwave did.  Looks like
they did it.

    Anyways, if you are trying to make stained wood, why don't you
just set the wood or object color to the stained color you want, rather
than the basic brown.  That is ADD the red in directly.

    Also, if the linear texture is working, APPLY IT FIRST, before
the wood texture.  This will cause the object to first be stained, and
to THEN apply the wood pattern.

    It is a good thing to remember that Imagine applies brushes and
textures in the order they are listed in the attributes requestor.

    Hope this helps.

               Michael Comet
               [e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re: Essence
Date:        Mon, 11 May 92 14:24:11 CDT
From:        Wayne Haufler 283-4160 <[e-mail]>

On May 6, Ben Gibson ([e-mail]) writes:

> Look what I found in the Apex Vendors area on Portal.
> Apex Software is proud to announce its new software product:
>
>                            ESSENCE
>                 Algorithmic Textures for Imagine

I know this is a late reply, but since nobody else has said it (I think),
I am VERY excited about this upcoming product.  Steve Worley has done it
again.  Am looking forward to getting my hands on it.


         __      Wayne A. Haufler   [Christian/SW Engineer/XWindows/Amigan]
\\ /\\ /\\ //_    [e-mail]    McDonnell Douglas-Houston
 \/--\// \//__    Hobby:"Exploring the Use of Computer Graphics and
     //                  Animations To Support Christian Endeavors"

##

Subject:     Wishlist for Imagine V3.0 - V4.0
Date:        Mon, 11 May 92 22:06:08 +0200
From:        Hannes Heckner <[e-mail]>

This is a mail for all people who are interessted in improving Imagine
to be the best one on the market. So if anyone has additional ideas
to the one mentioned below please add them. First I apologize for
my poor descriptions but english is not the best thing i can do.
Second I want the people at Impulse reply to me via this mailing
list when  they get this mail.

This a long wishlist for ImagineV3.0 and further versions.
I wrote this because I want  to get Imagine the best raytracer for
the amiga because I don't want to buy any further software like
caligari, raydance etc. etc.

Lets start:

1) Snap axis to grid. This option (in stage and detail) should
   place the axis of the current selected objects to the nearest
   grid cros-section.
2) One-dimensional movement. It would be handy to have an option
   in moving objects that would alow to move objects with the mouse
   only along one (!) axis. And what is more in fixed steps say 20 units
   or so. So if you want to move your object 40 units along the Y axis
   you only have to choose one-dim movement along Y axis (gadget !)
   and then do it (perhaps in conjunction with snap axis to grid)
3) Variables in the action editor. It would be great if you could place
   names instead of numbers in the frame counter string gadgets.
   For example instead of typing 100 in the frames counter you type

   "length_of_anim". Then you put a value (in a special editor)
   to this variable say: length_of_anim=100. Then you use this variable in all
actor-requesters: You define the appearence of a sphere in your scene by : Sphe
re from 0 to length_of_anim.
   At this point i must apologize for my poor english. I hope you'll get what i
 mean. The use of point 3 is that if you want your anim to be a bit      smooth
er then you only have to change the variable and to all of the actor
   requestors. Also it should be possible to do some basic calculation
   with it: You could specify a varible for an important point, say
   the beginning of a special effect e.g. "explosion=50" means that
   an explosion takes place at frame 50. Then you could tell imagine
   to start 5 frames later a movement along a path by: explosion + 5.

   A third important feature is that all calculation and values should

  B

   be displayed (and entered) in frames and time (e.g. seconds) so you
   will have a better view of your animation.
   (Oh god, describing technical things in english is sooo difficult)
4) Outlining feature:
   What about a feature to create an outline of an outline (funny ?).
   If you want to build a text-object with the edges reflecting the
   light (a much better picture then without) you could do this
   (in the detail editor) with outlining an outline of the
   converted (ILBM convert) picture of the logo. You make several layers of dif
ferent size (by outlinng them and then "skin" them together and voila
   the object is complete (a nice feature isn't it).

5) Gernal morphing. I know it's difficult but it would be nice if
imagine could morph (smoothly) between objects of different point number
and structure).

6) Scripts and/or Arexx.
   Many things in 3-d modelling could be done real quick if you could
   build a small script file and then compile it (or something) and
   then have imagine execute it. Some suggestions:
   - fractal mathematics
   - trees (like in raydance, would be real great !!!!!)
   - own textures-scripts.
   These scripts should be a small programming language with
   strucutre elements like: if then else, for next, procedural

   subdividing etc. The points of an object should be accessible via
   Vectors (example: sphere[100].x = x coord). I know that Glenn Lewis
   has programmed a TDDD-Lib where you can access object data via C
   programming. But as you see above there should be more than that.
7) Brush-morphing. Another hard thing to do, I know. But it would be
   a big thing if one could morph between different brushemaps.

8) Acceleration and Deacceleration. I think a more abstract aproach
   would be better: Very morphable thing (changeable by value) in
   B
   imagine should be accerable (deaccerable). For this there should
   be a new requester independent of all other data in the action
   editor. There you specify the velocity of change in a X/Y - axis
   diagramm where the X axis is the timeline (in frames or seconds)
   and the Y axis is the percentage of the start velocity.
   Example: You specify a starting value of 50 and then draw a
   sine-like curve into the requester. If you apply this acc/deacc

  setting (which should be savable - loadable etc.) to a path then
  a object should which is applied to the path should start with
  50 units/per frame then smoothly accerlerate and then smoothly de-
  accerlerate. I hope you got the point. This is again very hard
  to describe for me. This feature should be appendable everywhere
  where a smooth change takes place. e.g. in morphing objects,
  B
  changing colors, changing alignments etc. etc. This would be
  a real great thing  to have.

BGy the way. If anyone at Impulse reads this and gets interessted in
several points but doesn't understands completely what I mean or needs
further description (total descriptions with requesters etc.) then
mail me and I try to work out the points again. Perhaps I could
to tell you the things in german (this would be more easy for me).
B
But I'll try to say all in english.

So let's finish this first part. If anyone at Impulse gets this mail
please inform me that you got it, because it is stupid to write
wishlists when you don't get them and I have truck-loads of ideas left
to tell you, so please mail me.

Hannes

##

Subject:     FastROM
Date:        Mon, 11 May 1992 14:29:58 -0600
From:        HURTT CHRISTOPHER MICHAEL <[e-mail]>

    I don't know if this has ever be brought up but I did alittle test to
see if turning off FastROM affected the speed of rendering. With it on an
average pic (brushmaps, textures, scanline, etc) took 3:22. Off it took 3:35.
My guess the time is from loading everything in.
    So if you are dipping into chip ram with a pic, you might want to turn
off FastROM. And of course if you're running out to begin with. :)
    Does anyone else have any experience with rendering with FastROM on or
off? Also, anyone know of a CPU setter that has a GUI?

    Chris

##

Subject:     Re:  See thru maps
Date:        Mon, 11 May 92 20:37:05 -0400
From:        "Michael B. Comet" <[e-mail]>

>     Okay: but what if you have a brushmap and a texture?  I have such a
>beast, and the texture obscures the brushmap (camoflauge texture) and there
>is no way that I know of to tell the program to put the brushmap OVER the
>textured surface.  AM I wrong?
>
>-Bish
>
>

    Yea I know.  I just ran into this problem myself.  There is kind
of a way around it, but it pretty much defeats the purpose of the
brushmap.

    You can now (in version 2.0) restrict brushmap, textures and
just about everything else to a SUBGROUP of faces.  You go into pick
faces mode, select the ones you want to name as a SUBGROUP and select
MAKE SUBGROUP (from the functions menu I think).  Now, in the texture OR
Brushmap requestor, you can enter the SUBGROUP name you used to
restrict the texture or brushmap to that area.

    What this means is: If you have say a simple object, like a
plane with a lot of segments, you could make a subgroup of everything
BUT one segment, and apply the texture to that.  And then make ANOTHER
SubGroup of those lonely 2 faces (or however many), and apply the
brushmap to that.  The result would be what you want.

    Problems obviously occur with complex brushmaps, since what you
would need to do would be to essentially create the brushmap out of
polygons!  It DOES work though for some cases.

    Actually, you would probably use subgroups where you had a
complex object with mode than 1 texture on it.  You could make a weird
ball, and pick 4 stripes of faces, and then restrict a texture to each
one.  Poof:  Instant striped texture ball, with no overlapping textures.

    The only other way I think of doing what you want would be to
render the texture on a FLAT PLANE as a full screen pic, and to then
use the Art Dept. or some other program to composite the Genlocked map
you want, over the one you just made with the texture.  Then you could
save that and wrap that over your object.  A bit out of the way, but it
would probably work in a pinch.

    Hope this helps.  If anyone else has a solution to this problem
and you have actually read this far into the message, post!

               Michael Comet
               [e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re: Essence
Date:        Mon, 11 May 92 20:39:21 -0400
From:        "Michael B. Comet" <[e-mail]>

>On May 6, Ben Gibson ([e-mail]) writes:
>
>> Look what I found in the Apex Vendors area on Portal.
>> Apex Software is proud to announce its new software product:
>>
>>                            ESSENCE
>>                 Algorithmic Textures for Imagine
>
>I know this is a late reply, but since nobody else has said it (I think),
>I am VERY excited about this upcoming product.  Steve Worley has done it
>again.  Am looking forward to getting my hands on it.
>
>
>         __      Wayne A. Haufler   [Christian/SW Engineer/XWindows/Amigan]
>

    YES, YES YES YES YES....I want it!  Sounds realy good.  The
Fractal noise texture alone could be invaluable, as would the one that
subtly alters the colors of your object to make it look weathered.  If
anyone could post some sample texture renderings on hubcap in either HAM
or IFF 24, it would be greatly appreciated.

               Michael Comet
               [e-mail]

##

Subject:     Essence
Date:        Tue, 12 May 92 09:15:49 EDT
From:        [e-mail]

Souns absolutely wonderful. Mayhap we can talk Steve into selling us early
copies (perhaps without a printed manual, so we could get them sooner.)

I've love one to play with and show off to the other Imagine owners at AAI's
3D SIG.

Moo
Frank Branham

##

Subject:     Re:  See thru maps
Date:        Tue, 12 May 92 11:43:52 MDT
From:        Paul Johnson <[e-mail]>

> I am trying to create a wood plank that has the standard wood texture (no
>problem), but the wood I am modeling is stained. The wood itself is dark, the

>PAJ
Embarassing to have to respond to your own message :)

As Dan pointed out, when selecting attributes etc. for an object it is importan
t
to understand how the person views the object, rather than the real world natur
e
of same.

In my example the stained wood is such that one end of the plank shows mostly
the stain (a fairly bright, reddish orange), but the wood grain is still visibl
e
along with some of the original object color (a stain physically overlays the
original so you get mixing).

The other end reflects mostly the color of the wood and the wood grain, the
reddish stain is not really present.
I applied a linear texture of a reddish orange color in order to get a transi-
tion between the two ends that was not abrupt. This works fine. Also, as Michae
l
points out, the order of applying the textures is important. So, by applying th
e
wood texture first and the linear texture second the latter color replaces
the original object color _and_ the coloration of the wood.  Reversing the
order, the linear texture color is overlaid with the color of the wood grain,
while the original object color is not visible (where the linear texture takes
effect).

Both of the above effects are not exactly what I want. I want more of a semi-
transparent effect (like a real stain) where the "stain" color is mixed in
with the original object color + wood grain color.

Sigh, perhaps I'll have to wait for the new Essence package. A few of those
textures (HueRotate) may be adequate.

Oh, all suggestions for coloring the original object with the color of the stai
n
were valid if the _entire_ object were to have that color.  If my explanation
above is not clear I apologize. Hope others learn from my experience. That's
what this mailing list is all about (and _not_ about mailing list admin issues!
:) :)

PAJ

##

Subject:     RCS Fusion40 <> GVP 030/50mhz test result
Date:        Tue, 12 May 1992 22:15:49 GMT
From:        Stephen Menzies <[e-mail]>

Recently there have been a couple of posts questioning the performance
of the RCS040/28mhz over the GVP030/50mhz board. It had been suggested
that there was not a significant difference in speed. So, as promised,
I conducted a test rendering on both boards with a previous Imagine file
that I had done (Exploded Garden). This file has *many* objects in it
and totals somewhere around 70,000 polys. The rendering software used
was Imagine2.0 .All rendering was done on the Amiga2000 and the results
are as follows:

--------------------------

GVP GFORCE Combo 030/50mhz with 16megs/32bit:

File: exploded_garden
Render Mode: TRACE, QuarterScreen Hires 320x200,6/7, RGBN24
Anti-Alias=0 Depth=8
Global Size:auto-scale
Picture size=83740 bytes

Render Time: 30:27

---------------------------

RCS Fusion40/28mhz with 32megs/32bit:

File: exploded_garden
Render Mode: TRACE, QuarterScreen Hires 320x200,6/7, RGBN24
Anti-Alias=0 Depth=8
Global Size:auto-scale
Picture size=83736 bytes

Render Time: 9:04

---------------------------


It's appears that the RCS040 board in this case, was nearly 3.5x faster,
as I had expected it to be.

Oddly enough, I noticed that there is a 4-byte difference in the size
of the image file. It's possible that I wrote it down wrong (rounded it
off in my head). Other than that I have no explanation (there's no
difference in the images themselves).

As I mentioned before, the 040 loves polys and the more the faster. Very
simple tests with very simple scenes may show a slightly less significant
performance. This is the case with ALL the 040's out there.

Keep in mind also the the present day Amiga software in most/all cases have
NOT been compiled (optimized) for the 040. When this happens we will
see even greater preformance from the 040's.

I hope this clears up any doubts, premature misgivings, or confusion
due to some misinformation (for reasons unknown) that are presently
floating around.



-stephen




--
Stephen Menzies
#Internet: [e-mail]
#Fidonet : Stephen Menzies @ 1:167/265

##

Subject:     Lightning again, and a big HUH?
Date:        Tue, 12 May 92 17:29:54 PDT
From:        "Daryl T. Bartley" <[e-mail]>

Hope this works...I'm still lost as to where the list is/will be...(should that
be 'lists'?)

But nonetheless I had a question for anyone who's out there. I asked before, bu
t my guess is it didn't get anywhere.

I am still trying to get a nice lightning/crawling electricity effect in Imagin
e. I have tried various weird ways, but it's just not quite right. Has anyone e
lse gotten something similar to work?

Also, I might have found a way to do neon in Imagine. I was using two tubes, th
e
out one glass (colored or not), and the inner one a foggy, bright lightsource.
It looks sort of neon-ish.

Also, someone else alrady asked this, but I wanted to second it...could we see
some example renders of the new textures from Essence? Even the usual 'bunch of
spheres' or 'bunch of cubes' would work. I just want to see some of this stuff!

Thanks in advance.

Daryl Bartley
[e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re: Wishlist for Imagine V3.0 - V4.0
Date:        Tue, 12 May 92 19:49:47 -0700
From:        66291000 <[e-mail]>

First of all, I don't think that anyone at Impulse reads this mailing
list (though they should!).  But we could send them transcripts maybe?
(Wishful thinking, but this is, after all, a wish list.)

I haven't given it too much thought, but I thought I'd comment on the
first in the series of these.

Movement on one axis _is_ already possible.  After pressing 'm', hold
the shift key and press the letter of the axis you want to move in
(i.e. X, Y, or Z), and you're all set.

As to a different type of acceleration/deceleration feature, Amen to
that!  The best method I've seen is used on Animator: Journeyman (I
haven't seen Lightwave yet :-(.  It calls the thing a "channel" and
you describe a spline with as many control point as you want, and the
action (movement, rotation, size change, morph, anything) follows
that velocity curve.  It is absolutely the best method I can think of,
so please, Impulse, put it in Imagine.  (Or if they think of something
better, I _suppose_ it would be alright if they put that in instead:-)

I would like to see spline-based modeling, simulated shadows in scan-
line mode, and re-integration of the action and stage editors (why
should I have to save changes when I'm gonna keep working on the same
thing?).  And perhaps Impulse would like to spring for an '040 board
for me, too (I already said, this is a wish list...)

    TTFN
    - Stefon

##

Subject:     wish list
Date:        Tue, 12 May 92 21:53:40 GMT-0500
From:        Scott Matthew Krehbiel <[e-mail]>

Hi People,
I'm not all too familiar with Imagine, 'cause I can't play with it too
much ( doesn't school stink?? )
   So, I'm not a good person for 3d wish lists, but:

I'd like to get together a wish list for the ultimate Paint and Anim
program.  I'd like to hear what features you like about the different
Paint programs that you've worked with, (  all platforms, not just Amiga )
so I can get an idea what would make a top of the line paint program.

As an example, I really like the way ColorScheme ( Lumina 16 clone )
on the IBM has a feature called "Emboss" which treats a grey scale
as an altitude map, then renders it with light coming from whatever
direction you choose.  It's tough to describe, but the result is often
something that looks like a stone carving.

Anyway, please send me your paint comments ( yes, I know this is mailbox
suicide ) and I'll start designing this really cool program.

By the way, this is not something that I'll be able to code and create, since
I'm not a programmer.  It's just a thought experiment.

Thanks for the Bandwidth
[e-mail]

Scott Krehbiel

##

Subject:     Grouping
Date:        Wed, 13 May 92 11:53:51 CST
From:        Loyd Blankenship <fnordbox![e-mail]>

Ok, I'm trying a relatively simple grouping. I've got a wood box that is
open on one end (imagine a wooden shoebox with no lid). This is 1 object.
I also have a mirror that fits in the opening, facing out. This is a 2nd
object. I have them grouped together -- but when I use Replicate, it only
takes *one* of them along for the ride. I've tried it picked as a group, and
picked as two separate object (holding down the "shift" key).

I can't Join them (tho' I've tried it) because I end up with the wood grain
on the mirrored face (even after I've changed the Picked Faces.).

Help would be appreciated!

Loyd

***************************************************************************
* [e-mail]         Once you pull the pin,  *    Loyd Blankenship  *
* GEnie: SJGAMES        Mr. Grenade is no longer *    PO Box 18957      *
* Compu$erve: [73407,515]     your friend!         *    Austin, TX 78760  *
* cs.utexas.edu!dogface!fnordbox!loydb             *    512/447-7866      *
***************************************************************************

##

Subject:     Warp
Date:        13 May 92 19:58 -0500
From:        "S. Kormilo" <[e-mail]>

Hello,

I have been working on making an animation of the USS Enterprise warping,
or rather I have been trying to get the Enterprise to warp.  So here
is my question: What is the best way to get a nice looking warp out of
Imagine?

Sean.

##

Subject:     Re: Warp
Date:        Wed, 13 May 92 22:44:31 EDT
From:        Dan Drake <[e-mail]>

> I have been working on making an animation of the USS Enterprise warping,
> or rather I have been trying to get the Enterprise to warp.  So here
> is my question: What is the best way to get a nice looking warp out of
> Imagine?

I'm not totally sure that this will work, but one idea is to go into the
cycle editor, make a segment the enterprise.  Snapshop it.  Then go to
frame 80, and move the segment to make it longer.  Snapshot it.  Since you
want the morph to accelerate, snapshot some intermediate frames as needed.
Then set up the morph in the action editor.

This is not exactly want you want, because it will stretch the whole ship
at the same time.  One other suggestion is to start with your normal ship,
pick the initial points you want to stretch, save it as another object,
and repeat the process until you get one weird streched out enterprise.
You can accelerate the stretch by allowing the morph a descending amount
of frames between objects.

Hope this helps,

dan.

##

Subject:     Re: Replicating Grouped Objects
Date:        Thu, 14 May 92 10:45:34 -0400
From:        "Michael B. Comet" <[e-mail]>


    With regards to replicating the box and mirror:

    The answer is really basic, since there is no way around this
without actually joining the object.  Just replicate each one separately
with the same values in the requestor and the result should be what you
want.

               Michael Comet
               [e-mail]

##

Subject:     Re:  Warp
Date:        Thu, 14 May 92 14:32:07 -0400
From:        "ESTES,JON-PAUL" <[e-mail]>

Use the "boing" effect.  It allows you to stretch or compress in one
axis.  So, first stretch, the Enterprise as it accelerates, and very quickly
shrink it as it reaches it maximum velocity.

-- Jon-Paul Estes

##

Subject:     More Enterprise Problems
Date:        15 May 92 15:14 -0500
From:        "S. Kormilo" <[e-mail]>

  First, I would like to thank everyone for their help with the
  Enterprise warping... now I have another question...

  I scanned the plans of the enterprise out of the STTNG Technical
  manual in hopes that it would be possible to wrap the scans around
  the saucer section, so that I could get more detail on the ship.
  The problem is, that no matter how I wrap the damn thing, it never
  looks right!  If I wrap it onto a flat plane, it works fine, but
  as soon as I try to put it onto the top of the Enterprise, it becomes
  very distorted, and does not even come close to lining up properly.
  HELP!!

Thanks.

Sean.

##

Subject:     Re: More Enterprise Problems
Date:        Fri, 15 May 92 15:52:26 MDT
From:        Phil Batey <[e-mail]>

>Date: 15 May 92 15:14 -0500
>From: "S. Kormilo" <[e-mail]>
...
>  The problem is, that no matter how I wrap the damn thing, it never
>  looks right!  If I wrap it onto a flat plane, it works fine, but
>  as soon as I try to put it onto the top of the Enterprise, it becomes
>  very distorted, and does not even come close to lining up properly.
...

I read an article in Computer Graphics World a couple of months back that
described the way that ILM(I think) did the mapping of a face onto the T2000.
I guess they had to write a new mapping system that did "sticky mapping" this
would map the bitmap of the face and tack it down to the object facets.

Not sure if this really applies to your problem (I don't have Imagine). Sounds
like it tho'
--
Phil Batey
Auto-trol Technology
Design and Engineering Applications
[e-mail]